Toxins/Tying

John,

Good question.

5 min epoxy - I don't really consider the odor fumes - just stink.
When you walk into the shop of our local famous rod builder, you can smell the epoxy and he doesn't seem to be effected by it.

So, I'm not too concerend either. I just try not to eat it until it sets.

RE: Softex - I had to send my daughter out of the room the other night because she started coughing whne I was utting it on rather heavy & had left the top off. I don't know if it was due to the Softex but,I didn't want to take any chances.

I'm impressed by your use of the acrylic caulking - where did you find it, I searched once at Home Depot and had no success. How do your flies look? Please tell me you're using colors other than chartreuse!

Roop

Roop, thanks for the thoughts... The cauking idea came from a one of the two special guests at the UFT meeting this past week.. I found it at my local hardware store and it's called "LEXAL". It seems to be the only one where you can see right in the tube. All others Set to a milky white instead of Clear... Home depot is also a place I am told... It must be popular since I picked up the next to last tube at that store on Saturday. It is very tacky but soft and you have to be sure your fingers have some soapy water on the tips to be able to mold it the way you want... but not two much.. you need a small bowl of the soapy water to keep it from becoming tacky again... But you have to see these squid flies I did.. I used a permenant magic Marker to dot the hackels and dot the acrylac body, which works perfectly. The hooks were to small but I still had to experiment. I covered the shank with a sparkly type braid which you can see right though the cauking. looks so real, and the eyes are easy to stick on.. After about 30 hours to set, give or take ,I covered it with a thin coat of apoxy and it made the fly come alive . I will show them to you at the clave. This stuff works great to cover other large fly types and with the ability to draw on the acryac, the gills etc. can be detailed par excellence. The apoxy then makes it shine.

John -

I use epoxy and softex fairly often, silicone on rare occasions. For epoxy, I use a two-part Devcon primarily because it comes in large ketchup squeezer containers.

I use a square of tin foil 4-6" square after being folded over for strength, curl up the edges if you like. Then I use a Starbucks wooden stir stick to blend the two parts together. A scientist at 3M informed me that the two factors that yellow the glue are mixture and UV. You want to get the right mix, then keep them out of direct sun. The wood affecting the color is a myth, 3M provides a wooden stick with their package.

If using 5min, use small batches due to fast dry times. Roll up the tin foil and stick and throw it out - EZ cleanup.

Softex - I only use this to dab, and I close the jar partially after every dip of the starbucks stir stick. Don't leave it unattended, if you do even if it threads ok that day you'll never get it open another day later. Try not to get the stuff on the outside threads of the jar mouth. I dip the stick and remove excess so that it stays on the inside of the jar mouth. I currently have three jars: 1) the one I was careless with, still half full but can't open... 2) the one I was careful with, almost empty and can still open the jar... 3) the one a friend gave me after he read what Tolulene can do to your prospects for having children.

Suffice it to say, the solvent in Softex (also for neoprene repair glues like aquaseal) is highly toxic.

I haven't been using silicone as much as I used to but I suppose it's the safest of the lot. It is not as durable as others but it ls light as a feather and lets you build some really large profile flies with great action - kind of like a plug you can cast with a fly rod.


You need to know about another glue called Zap-a-Gap. When tying coastal SWFF flies, I use it instead of head cement in many cases, including the deep eel. It is tough enough to secure the threads around the weighted eye. Much different than the lacquers I use for steelhead and salmon flies, but in an instant the threads are hard as stone. Don't get any on the fingers, or you'll feel like the kid who put his tongue on the swingset on a cold winter morning.

Tie on!

Juro

Wait just a minute, John. A few more things to consider.

Here are a few more tips to fine-tune your epoxy artistry.

When measuring your epoxy, lay out parallel beads in the same amount. Just make sure the applicator doesn't touch the other substance. Easier to thoroughly mix this way. Puddles are two hard to mix completely. Improper mixing will cause the epoxy to stay soft and sticky.


Whether you use a stir stick or a bodkin, just make sure you don't lap the material. Avoid folding the mixture over each other. This will trap unsightly air bubbles in your mixture.

When you mix your epoxy and it clouds, get rid of it and buy a new set of bottles. There is a shelf life once you open the containers. I have yet to ever finish one completely.

If I'm going to apply epoxy in my basement where it's much cooler, the material becomes sluggish. Usually I keep in a warmer place in the house. Added heat will delay the curing process. This is good and bad. Good is you want to do more flies per batch. Bad because you have to tend to them longer.

Some of us use the "Post-em Pads" to mix on. The advantage is that they are already precut and you just rip one layer off after another.

RS

Hi John,
Boy, you've certainly found a way to keep busy this winter. Acrylics, E-Z sparkle body, Epoxies, things happen fast with flytying! The Chatham Anglers Society will never be the same!
To add to Ray's tips with epoxies; I also use the post-it pads, very easy to keep a pad on the bench with some stirrers from Dunk's. If you work in a cooler (or in my case COLD) part of your house, take the epoxy bottles and stand them in a basin of hot water (not boiling) for about 3-4 minutes before dispensing. Too hot and the epoxy will 'kick' but it helps when you are trying to put on a thin coat. ( I may have to try that Loctite version! )
Bubbles are also almost always going to get trapped, Page Rogers uses a trick where she holds the mixed epoxy up just below an incandescent light bulb and uses the ehat of the bulb to force out the bubbles, problem is you've already mixed and the clock is ticking. Add to that the heat from the bulb and you've got about three minutes to work with it.
No exposure issues that I've found with the epoxies, they don't rely on volatile chemicals that evaporate (like Softex). I'd say the best suggestion with epoxy is to keep it away from your mouth.
Softex is dangerous stuff to be exposed to for too long. If you want to use up what you have make sure you have a window open and/or a small fan to move some air. Anglers Choice has a water-based ( read: non-toxic ) version called Soft Body which sets a bit slower but is basically the same. (Available at Bears Den)

Glad you're having fun,
Bob

From the days of building kayaks, the exposure to polyesters, epoxys, and nasty solvents could be pretty high even for those building only a couple boats. Generally the only effect recognized by those doing this sort of thing was that some people eventually became acutely sensitized to the materials, usually exhibiting skin problems. Of course there may be internal effects too, but I don't recall anyone documenting these. The key was that the body didn't react to initial exposure the way that it eventually did after repeated exposure.

Avoiding exposure to these toxins seems like a good idea. On a job like a kayak we sometimes layed up the wet fiberglass in a cool garage and then kicked the cure over by heating the garage. This allowed us time to get the layup correct without a race against the clock. You may be able to come up with a similar concept for working on flies.