Oversand Question - Fly Fishing Forum
Stripers and Coastal Gamefish Stripers, Blues, Inshore tuna!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 02-27-2002, 01:27 PM
Nick's Avatar
Nick Nick is offline
Shark Bait
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Ahhhlington, MA (Boston)
Posts: 1,146
Send a message via AIM to Nick Send a message via Yahoo to Nick
Oversand Question

I really want to get an oversand pass this summer at Nauset. I am just a little leary of my Escape being able to handle it. I know all the reasons why it won't be able too, I'm more interested in a real world field test. Problem lies in that I don't want to shell out big money for a pass, full size spare, etc. when I don't know if I'm even gonna be able to hang. I have read reviews of others that took their Escape on the Cape Cod National seashore and it performed great. I guess my question is there anywhere around where I can try it on the sand for a day and see how it goes? Either on the South shore (Duxbury, Plymouth), the Cape, or even down into RI. I don't mind driving to get there, just want to see how it goes. Thanks for the help!

Nick
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #2  
Old 02-27-2002, 01:55 PM
juro's Avatar
juro juro is offline
Coast2coast Flyfishaholic
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Steelhead country|striper coast|bonefish belt
Posts: 20,593
Nick -

The Nauset passes run May thru May. Let's get together in April for a little field test. There should be some early striped arrivals on the Nantucket Sound side as well to get a bend in the rod.

Early sand conditions are not the same as mid-summer though, the sand gets pretty fluffed up from people tearing it up all day.

You tend to get stuck most of the time making maneuvers around other vehicles, trying to get too close to the fishing spot off the tracks, or getting on or off the beach to the dune roads over deep, soft passages thru the dunes (marked with a number, e.g. area 5).

For the most part I'm sure you will be fine on the existing tracks, it's the ability to deal with deep, churned up spots that you need to test.

A lot of that is how people drive - even though the vehicle coming off the beach has right of way, on a hill IMHO it makes much more sense for the vehicle coming downhill to yield.

When an uphill driver has to yield onto soft sand it really screws things up for him. The downhill driver has gravity on his side to pull off, then it helps start rolling onward as well. How do we get this driving law changed?

I have a number of spots on the Cape that would be good test areas other than Nauset, closer to the bridge. Let's go via buddy system just in case.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #3  
Old 02-27-2002, 02:23 PM
grego's Avatar
grego grego is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: NorthEast
Posts: 835
Nick,

I think your biggest concern will be ground clearance. Between those deep tracks you get a big "Crown". Also, when you put your tires down to 20 PSI, you loose another inch or so. On the plus side, you have a pretty short wheel base, most people don't realize that this is benefitial, cause in a 4X4 you aint stuck till your resting on your frame! So, a short WB SUV can acutally have a leg up over a longer wheel base like a full size PU. This is why the old Jeeps (CJ's, Wrangler) are good in the sand, short wheel base.

I think Juro's Idea of a buddy-system test run is a good one; just bring a Tow Rope!
__________________
grego
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #4  
Old 02-27-2002, 03:22 PM
Nick's Avatar
Nick Nick is offline
Shark Bait
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Ahhhlington, MA (Boston)
Posts: 1,146
Send a message via AIM to Nick Send a message via Yahoo to Nick
Juro,
Thanks for the offer, I'm definitely game. We'll have to pick a good weekend and go for it. I think the buddy system is the way to go. I can't wait for the fish to arrive.

Grego,
I'm with you in that the clearance is one of my fears out on Nauset. I saw some ruts from a great vantage point last summer (Juro's Truck) that made me a little nervous, but I think I should be OK. Like I said, I have no problem putting some money into it(bigger tires, maybe a slight lift) if I know it will be worth it. I probably won't do it more than 5 times a year, so I'm not overly concerned. Just looking for a little adventure. One more thing, another advantage is that my car is pretty light as far as 4x4's go, so that should keep me floating nice.

Nick
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #5  
Old 02-27-2002, 04:21 PM
grego's Avatar
grego grego is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: NorthEast
Posts: 835
Nick,

Bigger Tires is a pretty safe bet. You can usually go up 1-2 sizes without a problem. More then that you can run into problems with your computer controlled emmissions, cause your actual speed versus RPMs will get out of wack (due to the larger tire circumfrence). This can be fixed by getting a special gear for your speedo that corrects for the larger tire size. They have these at the custom truck shops. They'll also know what size you can go up to without interferring with your steering, wheel-wells, roll-over danger, etc.

The next level of $$ is to go to bigger & Wider tires. Wider helps A LOT in sand, cause your weight gets distributed over more tire surface area, which prevents sinking in. This can cost more if you need to go to a Wider Rim & you may need wheel-well extensions to stay legal.

Small lift kits (under 3") that don't require much suspension modification can usually be found. But since the Escape has not been out long, it may not exist yet.

Money wise, I'd look into the biggest & widest tires that you can "safely" put on your existing rims. Your MPG will go down & your ride may be less quite.
__________________
grego
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #6  
Old 02-27-2002, 04:21 PM
JimW JimW is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: As long as it's Salty
Posts: 1,795
Plymouth is a walk in the park compared to the south side and vineyard. I wouldn't get new tires, in fact street tires will often out perform "off road tires". A tread with a bite to it tends to dig while a smoother tread tends to float. You let the air out to give more surface area so that you don't dig in as easily, think of it like snow shoes. I don't know much about the awd vs 4wd but I can tell you this. I've only used the low gear 4wd once on Wasque, my first time in real sand. I let the air out to 22lbs (they want you to go down to 15) 22 looked pretty low to me and I didn't want to break the seal. The first intersection of paths was very deep soft sand, I yeilded to another vehicle. When I hit the gas I buried all 4 wheels in 4wd high gear. I pushed the sand out of the way as I opened the door and let the air down to 15lbs put it in low and it pulled right out.
Beware of loop-d-do's they are a killer on the back.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #7  
Old 02-27-2002, 04:47 PM
Nick's Avatar
Nick Nick is offline
Shark Bait
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Ahhhlington, MA (Boston)
Posts: 1,146
Send a message via AIM to Nick Send a message via Yahoo to Nick
Grego,
Thanks for the tips, if it all works out that's what I'll end up doing when I need new tires. I know the ride will suffer some, but that's alright.

Jim,
I'm hoping to try it out and find my limitations. If I can't make it out onto the outer beaches with the Sugar Sand, then maybe I'll have to look into other options.

Nick
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #8  
Old 02-28-2002, 07:37 AM
jborkowski jborkowski is offline
Active Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: New England
Posts: 248
Send a message via AIM to jborkowski
Hey Nick and Juro,

When you guys head out for your test, let me know; I'd love to tag along as well. I just bought an oversand machine myself and am dieing to test it out.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #9  
Old 02-28-2002, 07:57 AM
juro's Avatar
juro juro is offline
Coast2coast Flyfishaholic
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Steelhead country|striper coast|bonefish belt
Posts: 20,593
Sounds good Jeff. April scout trip + 4x4 excursion.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #10  
Old 02-28-2002, 08:07 AM
Nick's Avatar
Nick Nick is offline
Shark Bait
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Ahhhlington, MA (Boston)
Posts: 1,146
Send a message via AIM to Nick Send a message via Yahoo to Nick
Jeff,
What did you end up getting? I remember you investigating a while ago. Looking forward to our excursion. We should get sponsors to fund the forum. We can have our trucks shrinkwrapped with ads and all proceeds got to forum. :hehe:

Juro,
Thanks for the message. When do you wanna do lunch?

Nick
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #11  
Old 02-28-2002, 08:12 AM
Tod D Tod D is offline
Here fishy fishy
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: south shore MA, cape cod
Posts: 395
Nick,
I'd echo Jim's comments re Plymouth when talking about Duxbury. While Dux has a few spots (way, way down the south end of the beach) that have some deep sand, it doesn't come close to Nauset and Wasque. In fact, the deepest sand we encounter there is typically right at the crossovers (from the access road to the beach). Also, a nonresident pass is pricy.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #12  
Old 03-07-2002, 09:12 AM
2HandTheSalt 2HandTheSalt is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Cape Cod
Posts: 301
Send a message via Yahoo to 2HandTheSalt
I would recommend that you contact the Orleans Parks Dept., and see if that vehicle will even be allowed on Nauset. They have specific guidelines with regards to vehicle/tire size which may prohibit some of these new road suv's.

Your problem is definitely going to be ground clearance. You are definitely going to get stuck. Once you learn the tricky places you can avoid them better and you will get stuck less. Keep your shovel and tow rope handy.

One more time, I would like to say that you guys driving in 4-wheel high with 20psi are the ones who are chewing the beach to shreds during the season! The reason the law says 15psi is so that you will not ruin the buggy trail. 12psi is even better.

There is a very real chance that Nauset oversand trail will be closed to non-property owners in the near future. As oversand permit users we all have a responsibility to minimize our impact on the environment. Drive responsibly, use four-wheel low, and 12-15psi, please!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #13  
Old 03-07-2002, 10:09 AM
Nick's Avatar
Nick Nick is offline
Shark Bait
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Ahhhlington, MA (Boston)
Posts: 1,146
Send a message via AIM to Nick Send a message via Yahoo to Nick
2handthesalt,

Thanks for the advice. I have looked up the specs and my tires are big enough to pass. I have every intention of dropping the tire pressure down to around 15. That place of land is a very special thing that we have here in Mass. Some of the most beautiful beach views, unbelievable fishing, and a site to really feel like you have left the civilized world. If it goes away, not only do we lose that, we lose the history that that stretch of land has. I wish I was alive during the heydays of the beach buggies. What a life.

NIck
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #14  
Old 03-07-2002, 10:22 AM
juro's Avatar
juro juro is offline
Coast2coast Flyfishaholic
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Steelhead country|striper coast|bonefish belt
Posts: 20,593
Jay -

Good points about being cautious and conscientious.

I know it was just a figure of speech when you say "you guys" but as one who did 20-ish trips out on Nauset last year as a non-resident owner but conscientious 4x4 driver with properly lowered pressure each and every time - I have some observations to offer. There are those who give a damn and those who don't. Residence on either side of the canal has nothing to do with it, just as you gave a damn before you moved on Cape a couple of years ago.

Some of us deflate properly even when they shut down the pumps for the season and we have to drive up to rte 28 all floppy risking tire damage. But all summer I see a lot of young sun-seeking locals boogie right through without even a thought of deflation. Sure, many leave their tires slightly lower all the time, but they sure as heck aren't running them at 15! (It's easy to see who's who with the sticker colors) I understand - I was young and reckless once too and did a lot worse things than that. My point is it's about those who care and those who don't. Once again I know it's a figure of speech but you'd be hard-pressed to find someone who qualifies as "you guys" in this community.

Your point is taken though, and it's great food for thought. Could you provide more detail in the benefits of 4x4 low over 4x4 high? I run a v8 4x4 pickup truck and have yet to dig in or churn things up. Should I be in low? Should it be made a regulation? I'm all ears (get it?)

Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #15  
Old 03-07-2002, 12:34 PM
Nick's Avatar
Nick Nick is offline
Shark Bait
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Ahhhlington, MA (Boston)
Posts: 1,146
Send a message via AIM to Nick Send a message via Yahoo to Nick
Juro,
As far as running on low air off the sand, my solution is going to be (if I end up going through with this) picking up one of those 12V air compressors. They have an exceptionally long cord usually and are only around 20 bucks.

Nick

Something like This
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Fly Fishing Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
PFD question / Anchor question debarb Inflatable Watercraft 5 07-25-2003 04:16 PM
Question... fishboyicu812 Stripers and Coastal Gamefish 4 03-18-2003 12:44 PM
Question joe wojtan >> Archive: Striper (etc) Flies 2 06-25-2002 09:23 AM
OverSand or simply Stuck in the Dirt? jborkowski Stripers and Coastal Gamefish 18 10-11-2001 07:36 PM
Oversand Vehicle Pass Nick Stripers and Coastal Gamefish 2 04-17-2001 12:44 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:20 AM.



Copyright Flyfishingforum.com (All Rights Reserved)