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Pacific Northwest Sea Run Forum No such thing as rainbow trout, only landlocked steelhead

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Old 01-02-2002, 02:22 PM
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Question for youutube fly guys

From speaking with Brian (Doublespey) and reading what the rest of you have said about tube flies, I'm looking at getting a startup kit to tie my own up. What I'm curious abouut is how much shoould these starter kits go for? Say, one with 3 mandrels of different sizes, instructions, and multiple types of tubes. I haave a chance to get this system for abou $23 and was wondering if it's too expensive or not. Yes, I knnow Ii can go chea and use a nail inn my vise, but figured if I'm gonna do it, I'l go all out.

Or, if by chance you kknow where to buy a system let me know. I don't want to spend afortune, but at same time I want a decent system from get go instead of having to upgrade later. Just my opinion anyways.
Thanks Jerry
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  #2  
Old 01-02-2002, 02:33 PM
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Mine cost about $40, sounds like the one you describe. It's the Kennebec River model, I really like it. Of course you don't really need anything fancy as the other people who recently commented on this topic said...

http://www.flyfishingforum.com/flyta...highlight=tube

(others out there, try "search" for more good posts)
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  #3  
Old 01-02-2002, 03:00 PM
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Hey '69,

The systems like one I have (with a small metal square that holds the mandrels and is clamped in the jaws of a traditional vise) can be had for less than $50. They usually come with 3 size mandrels and instructions. And if I was selling mine, i'd probably let it go for about $25 too.

It's a good place to start, but if you get seriously into the tube fly thing I'd highly recommend (as would others - Kush? Black Salmon?) a vise conversion kit like that offered by Renzetti. The conversion kit replaces the whole head of the vise and is a very efficient and clean system. Or just buy the entire tube fly vise. The drawback is that they're somewhere between $50 and $100 buckaroos, so it's a bit more of a committment.

Here are some options and prices - see how the kit you're considering buying compares.

Happy Tying!

DS

Tube Fly vise options
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Old 01-02-2002, 05:28 PM
fredaevans fredaevans is offline
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Save or spend the $

The HMH pin vises really work, but the difference in price for the basic vs. the upscale one is the three mandrels you get. If you're not going to pop for the extra $, and have a vise with good clamp pressure, just use different sized finishing nails.

The nail heads give you the 'butting up' you need to hold the tube in place if you push the end of the tube firmly up against the jaws of the vise. What the hmh clamp does is simplify the process of getting the nail, et. al. on/off and is more secure way of holding the mandrel.

Well thinking about this you really could use the less expensive vice and the nails. Damn, wish I'd thought of that before I spent the rest of the money.

Also, most hobby stores have a ton of tubing, etc., for building tube flys, ditto pet stores for clear/stiff white tubes at far less cost. And as we've over killed the info about the plastic Q-tip bodies I won't go there other than to say you can get them in white, light blue and pink. 300 for a buck fifty 'tain't bad.
fe
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Old 01-02-2002, 06:00 PM
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I agree with Doublespey, the Renzetti system is the way to go, especially if you already have a Renzetti Traveller, as the tube fly head is relatively cheap. The great thing about the Renzetti is the rotary action which certainly come in handy when tiying grosses of Thompson Stones!

As to whether you will get into tubes - yes it will happen! The biggest thing I can point to is the beach to hookup ratio - there is a huge difference. Having just completed my 2001 records (the first year I used tubes exclusively) I can say that my traditional beaching ratio of around 50% is dwarfed by this years 82%! Enough said.
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Old 01-02-2002, 06:07 PM
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Doublespey Doublespey is offline
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Fred's right on that there are always cheaper ways to do things.

But there are prices that are also paid for doing so. I used the HMH vice for quite a while before I got the Renzetti Tube Fly conversion kit. The difference is definitely noticable!

When using the Rotary feature of this vice to apply dubbing etc you get a nice clean pivot without the metal attachments and screws that get in the way with HMH. And nails can slip out of the vise easily with the wrong pressure - not fun when you're 3/4 of the way thru a complex tie and end up chasing your creation around the floor.

Additionally, you can get caught using cheap materials for your tubes and undercut one of the big advantages this style of fly - their longevity. Several of us have tried the Q-tips for tubes and discovered they ~break~ very easily. Kinda sad when your last exquisitely tied Black Maribou GP becomes unexpectedly jointed halfway thru a run

There are deals out there, and I for one love to find 'em! The comment about hobby shops is dead on - i've found great micro-surgical and hard tubing at my local hobby shop that's the best. I don't want to divulge other's stories, but I've heard entertaining tales of materials purloined from both medical and auto parts stores that attest to the creativity of our Flytalk members!


Having seen both the quantity and quality of your ties, I'd definitely recommend looking at a full vise. Hell, I'll be happy to lend you my HMH tool if you want to try tube tying for a while. It has 3 mandrels and works with any vise. Then if you like tying/fishing tubes you can invest in a good vise.

let me know!

DS
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  #7  
Old 01-02-2002, 11:27 PM
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tubes is tops!

Kush is right about the hooking/landing ratio. I too was a 50% steelheader...until this season. Fishing tubes exclusively has taken me up to 70% h/l r overall. The short shanked hooks make all the difference, as does the style of hook. I experimented with a number of different hooks through the better part of the year. My h/l ratio was @ 65% for most of the season using Tiemco 105s and a few other hooks such as the Daiichi tube hooks on winter and summer fish. Once on the Thompson I switched to the Partridge Single Nordic hooks for the remainder of the season and my h/l ratio jumped to 82%.
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Old 01-03-2002, 01:12 PM
fredaevans fredaevans is offline
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Yuck! First I've heard of Q-tip material braking.

Don't think that nasty little fact has come up before. Got 300 of them yesterday ..... any of you need a supply of ear cleaners? The plastic is a light pink .....
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  #9  
Old 01-03-2002, 01:30 PM
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Doublespey Doublespey is offline
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Hey Fred,

Don't dispair - just tie disposable flies on those pink tubes!

They're also great for cleaning out the female ferrules (if you use wax) of your spey rods and other on-the-river maintenance.

And BTW - I like that cone head tube fly you posted. Just the ticket for river salmon fishing!!

hasta,

DS
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  #10  
Old 01-03-2002, 03:07 PM
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Cheer up Fred

Hi Fred.
Look at http://globalflyfisher.com/patterns/templdog.htm

They seem to use Cotton Buds with no problem.

Malcolm
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  #11  
Old 01-03-2002, 06:48 PM
fredaevans fredaevans is offline
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"Pink butted tube flys" cont.

Thanks for the heads up; already downloaded/printed off several of the patterns mentioned. Big Single Malt and back to the Bench tonight.

Joan knew what she was getting into with me back in 1984; zip has changed. Consistency must count for something?
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Old 01-03-2002, 08:08 PM
Yelostn801 Yelostn801 is offline
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Will someone please explain to me why a tube fly with a short shank hook has better hooking charcteriztics than say a, chemically sharpened salmon fly hook. It seems to me the tube would be just like a long shank. Does the fly dressing come unbuttoned from the hook after a hook up?
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  #13  
Old 01-03-2002, 09:03 PM
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Have the Renzetti traveller will need to check out the tube fly adaptor and tie up some tubes. Sounds like they are very effective.

But how do you tie a natural looking steelhead nymph on a tube fly ?
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  #14  
Old 01-03-2002, 10:14 PM
fredaevans fredaevans is offline
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'Short shanked hooks' do bring something to the party.

First, when a fish hooks up with a tube fly, the 'fly,' almost always, floats up off the hook and up onto the leader. Just hook and fish. The short shanked hook doesn't give the fish any leverage against the metal to tweek around with, especially given the fly 'is gone.'

Same (from all info gained) is true regardless of using a single, double (watch these as frequently they are a long shaked hook -- look to the Loop doubles to solve this issue) or treb's.
fe
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  #15  
Old 01-03-2002, 10:17 PM
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hooks & stoneflies

Short shanked hooks have much less leverage associated with them than long shanks, so it is tougher for them to work their way out over the course of a fight. Most tube tiers design their flies so that the hook will pull free of the tube on hook up, but I haven't had a problem with LDRs even when the hooks don't pull free with the flexible tubing I use.

For stoneflies talk to your local auto repair shop and see if they can get you the plastic nozzles used for WD-40-type lubricants. I got a ton from a local shop and they work well for tying smaller, slimmer bodied tube flies.
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