Stripping Basket when wading for Bonefishing - Fly Fishing Forum
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Old 08-15-2007, 07:40 AM
Swalt Swalt is online now
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Stripping Basket when wading for Bonefishing

Do you use a strippng basket when wading for bonefish? I am interested in knowing why or why not and which one you may use.

I have never used one but there have been times when I wished I was. Line around mangrove shoots, around legs etc etc. Even given that, the designs, I have seen, looked like they would get in the way more than they would help.

I am thinking of designing one that would be packable and sit low on your thigh (where the regular stripping motion would put the line right in it). There may be one already out there that I have not come across. I don't like the mesh ones because in high winds your line can become tangled.
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Old 08-15-2007, 09:26 AM
BigDave BigDave is offline
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I have tried it with a collapsable one and did not like it. This was the old orvis progrip model. I felt like it got in the way of the long strip when you have to reposition the fly or set the hook. Bone flats are usually windy and the line tends to blow around the basket, buckle, etc.

You might want to check out the Stan Pleskunas baskets - he makes a "hip shooter" type model. I bought one of his VLMDs for boat use and the thing is incredibly well made and thought out.
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Old 08-15-2007, 10:58 AM
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Hi Swalt
A stripping basket can be very usefull when fishing beaches, where there are waves like in Los Roques. The advantages are the same as for any beach fishing and I would use a basket similar to those used on the Cape.
When wading on normal flats, I don't believe a basket is necessary unless there is a very strong current running. I have never felt the need to use one.

When fishing from a skiff in the wind, I like to use a bucket type of line tamer. This stops the line from tangling around anything and stops you standing on the line when a 15lb bonefish takes your fly.

In general terms if you feel better with a basket then use one.

I have used a pack away model from William Joseph that I don't like and also the Orvis basket that was OK.


Pete
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Old 08-15-2007, 06:36 PM
bobsold bobsold is offline
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The primary purpose of any basket it to nicely hold the line as you move about. Going out of your way to strip into it serves no purpose and often gets in the way of stripping the way you want. Something on the hip is perfect.
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Old 08-16-2007, 06:32 AM
Swalt Swalt is online now
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BigDave,
The Hip-Shooter is the one I am working on modifying. It's a great design, just don't want it on my hip. His VLMD's are very good.

Pete,
Sometimes when wading a flat you end up with all the combinations you mentioned where you may or may not need a basket. If you had something that didn't get in the way on open flats but could be used when walking the shore, in current or around mangroves it would be ideal.

You could also use it when fishing from a boat. When it your turn to sit down just store the line in the basket and its ready when you get back on the deck. Save time and maybe give you a shot at that fish that shows up when you would normally be getting your line out and set up.

Bobsold,
I agree with the primary purpose of a basket but to have one on your hip when stripping for bonefish would just get in the way. When I make a long strip that you use for bonefish my hand nearly brushes my hip on each strip. You could put it on the opposite hip but that would be awkward when stripping your line into it for storage. Lower on the stripping side thigh would not interfer with your natural stripping motion and be handy for storing your line at the same time.
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Old 08-16-2007, 07:44 AM
JR SPEY JR SPEY is online now
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Have you actually used a Hip shooter? I could see if one simply looked at the photos where you might get the idea that it would get in the way, but in actual use it doesn't. First of all, long strips are far more common when tarpon fishing. If your stripping is so long that the basket gets in the way, in my opinion your strips would be too long most of the time. Unless you have exceptionally long arms you couldn't strip more than a few more inches (OK, maybe a foot) farther anway. When your hand contacts the rear of the basket it is already well behind your hip bone. It is such a natural motion and when your hand contacts the back of the basket you just release the line. It couldn't be easier and is such a more comfortable approach than the basket sitting out front of you. That was unnatural, and so interfered with both stripping the fly and fighting a fish, that I never could get used to using one. I know the East coast striper and bluefish guys will find it hard to convert because they've used the other style for so long, but I'm betting that eventually everyone will wonder why it took so long to come up with such a sensible approach.
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Old 08-16-2007, 10:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JR SPEY
I know the East coast striper and bluefish guys will find it hard to convert because they've used the other style for so long, but I'm betting that eventually everyone will wonder why it took so long to come up with such a sensible approach.
I haven't seen the exact model you guys are referring to but I think the big difference for the "East Coast" guys is the depth at which we are often wading. It sounds like the models mounted on your thigh would be underwater in many situations out here. I think most of us have adapted our strip and basket location for the given situation. I use the old Orvis gray basket on the flats here and postion the basket on the side of my hip when retrieving into the basket. To others points I often don't strip into the basket if I have a fish in front of me. I still don't have it down pat but plan on further work this winter to keep the coils in my hand rather than dragging the line in the water on the bone flats.

Sean
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Old 08-16-2007, 12:13 PM
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I've bonefished quite a bit over the years but never used a basket.

I think the primary reason a basket is critical in striper fishing is not just strip length per se but total strip distance during focused sight fishing. In other words, the area within which you tease a bone is quite small, then you need to make another cast to it or it's buddies.

Stripers on the other hand are predominately blind fished and you cast as far as you can then strip it to the knot. That requires a basket.

The other points are valid - wading depth (sharks are rare on the striper flats) and wave turbulence (macrame with the legs). But I have fished without a basket in surf and on striper flats without any problems having spent many years handling long loops on rivers in the pacific northwest before the Spey days.

But I often hold loops of line beyond the tip-top on bonefish flats, not off the reel. Drop and cast. A bucket is of no value there.

The occasion that I dislike without a basket on bonefish flats is when the current is flowing strong opposite the wind. This sweeps the loops one side while the wind forces safe casting on the other.

For optimal shooting, you need the loops to be on the water on the same side as the cast. They lift off and into the shoot much better than when across the other side of the body and under tension of current.

A larger quantity of smaller loops and more false casts solve this problem but I prefer minimum false casts and fewer bigger loops when I can get them.

However current is often light in bonefish country and there's a 75% percent chance that the wind is not a cross-wind.

Not enough for me to ever want a basket on a bonefish flat.

The majority of Northeastern salt anglers in truth just don't know how to manage loops in the line hand because they skip right over the loop management skills when they buy the bucket with the beginner 9ft'er.

Spending a few days without a basket will do wonders for your loop management and you won't miss it on a bonefish flat, IMHO.
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Old 08-16-2007, 02:59 PM
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Also my 2 cents added here is the type of line you are using.

For floating lines (which is probably 95% of bone fishing I would guess) I see no need for a stripping basket, even here in the northeast. Like Juro I am used to managing large amount of line in loops from steelhead fishing with 2 handers. If the line is floating usually having some floating around you is not a huge deal. The line will still shoot fairly well off the water as it is on top.

However for fast sinking lines and even intermediates a basket can be a big plus which is why you see more northeast guys using them. They are the predominant line types out here. Mainly cause any line you lay on the water is going to sink and require many false casts to get it out of the water. Pain in the arse without a basket of some sort.

-sean
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  #10  
Old 08-16-2007, 03:16 PM
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JR,
I have not used the Hip-Shooter but that brown truck should be bringing me one in the next couple of days. I may like it as is. I think its the best design I have seen. "Long Streep, Long Streep" I have heard that from a number of guides in the Bahamas. They wanted the strip to come back behind you, past the hip.

I can't identify with you NE guys cause I have not done that type of fishing. I have never used a striping basket before when bonefishing but there have been times when I saw a bonefish and my line was fouled up in someway when I needed to have the fly in front of the fish. I may end up leaving it in the boat but I want to try it.
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Old 08-16-2007, 03:40 PM
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I looked at the hip shooter and have a few assumptions about it having never used one...

#1 - it has holes in it so it's useless for wading.

#2 - it lacks stiffness so it's useless for wading.

#3 - long tie wraps promote cross-over wraps in the running line and are not as effective as cones

#4 - Why the $%^#&(*%^#@ does every one thing what they read on Dan Blanton's site is the sh*t?

If hardcore flyguys like BigDave didn't vouch for them I would not believe it was any more than just hype. But if Dave's used them then I know it's probably a great solution for fishing from a boat. I maintain from experience points #1 and #2 though, and am only guessing from the picture on point #3.
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Old 08-16-2007, 03:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swalt
"Long Streep, Long Streep" I have heard that from a number of guides in the Bahamas. They wanted the strip to come back behind you, past the hip.
I think that is just their way of saying set the hook or maybe you cast too far and need to get the fly in position before the bone arrives. In my experience short twitches are the most commong retrieves when actually presenting to the fish.

Sean
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Old 08-17-2007, 07:03 AM
Swalt Swalt is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juro
I looked at the hip shooter and have a few assumptions about it having never used one...

Juro, the one I ordered came in the mail yesterday.

#1 - it has holes in it so it's useless for wading.

I don't understand why if it has holes in it that it is useless for wading, especially shallow bonefish flats? It does have an insert that you can get with it that does not have holes.

#2 - it lacks stiffness so it's useless for wading.

It is surprisinly stiff and has no problem holding it shape. Its not neoprene but a fairly stiff foam that will fold with the insert out but holds its shape with it in. Weight is about 1.5lbs.

#3 - long tie wraps promote cross-over wraps in the running line and are not as effective as cones.

I thought of that also, havn't had a chance to test it yet.

#4 - Why the $%^#&(*%^#@ does every one thing what they read on Dan Blanton's site is the sh*t? :lildev
I have found a lot of valualble information on his board as I have here. My 2 go to boards. They do promote sponser products strongly but thats not unusual.

If hardcore flyguys like BigDave didn't vouch for them I would not believe it was any more than just hype. But if Dave's used them then I know it's probably a great solution for fishing from a boat. I maintain from experience points #1 and #2 though, and am only guessing from the picture on point #3.
JR,
From just putting it on my hip it is far better for stipping directly into than I thought it would be. The lowering of the foam in the front helps with that. You strip into it till you hand hits the back of it, which is even with or past your butt, and just drop your line in. I would like it to be a bit lower but that can probably be done by just losening my belt.
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Old 08-17-2007, 07:35 AM
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"F***** BASKET!"

This discussion brings a little smile on my face.
I visited Los Roques march this year... We (my fishing buddies and I) hooked up with a local guide for a few days. We didn't really hire him, but he rather joined our daily trips to the surrounding keys (we did hire him for one day to visit the pancakes).
Anyways, im so used to wear my Orvis basket at the danish shorelines and I cant imagine flyfishing without. So, of course I brought it to LR as well. Our friend (Jesus was his name) kept swearing and cursing the use of stripping basket, and used every occasion to say "F****** Basket" with a smile...

Then one day after hooking up a bone, I dismantled the basket for better fighting. Watch below:

Notice the basket


Smile....


Run basket, run!



Jesus was standing on the beach and screaming "RUN BASKET, RUN!!!!"... It was worth it all

By the way, rather scary to swim over the drop-off. However, the basket was safely returned
Anyway, I was glad I brought it there. As Pete mentions, there can be quite some waves in Los Roques... I believe it helped me on the pancakes as well. Im very novice in bonefishing (first trip) so it gave me "a good feeling". I will very likely bring it anywhere in the world as part of my flyfishing gear.
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Old 08-17-2007, 08:03 AM
JR SPEY JR SPEY is online now
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[QUOTE=juro]I looked at the hip shooter and have a few assumptions about it having never used one...

#1 - it has holes in it so it's useless for wading.

#2 - it lacks stiffness so it's useless for wading.

#3 - long tie wraps promote cross-over wraps in the running line and are not as effective as cones

#4 - Why the $%^#&(*%^#@ does every one thing what they read on Dan Blanton's site is the sh*t?

#1 - There is a separate bottom that can be used which does not have holes. Additional cost is $10.00.

#2 - It is stiffer than it looks. It certainly is stiffer than the mesh baskets that many East Coast guys still use. It is not as stiff as the dishpan approach, but is closer to it than I think most believe by simply looking at a photo.

#3 - Having never used a cone basket I can't comment to this other than to say I have no trouble at all with running line literally flying out of this one. There are two different types of "stalks" and it seems to work best if you use both the wider PVC stalks and the thinner mono stalks (about 600lb mono) together.

#4 - I had a comment all ready for this one, but have decided to decline. What I will say is that the ganging on for the Hip Shooter on Dan's site is no different than that given to Danielsson reels on this site every time a discussion about reels comes up. Nothing wrong with it, and it happens on just about every forum.
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