Snap-T - Fly Fishing Forum
Art of Casting Analysis, refinement of the cast

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 08-31-2005, 02:29 PM
marcusjanssen marcusjanssen is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: River Spey, Scotland. River Avon, Scotland. Umzimkulu River, South Africa.
Posts: 54
Send a message via MSN to marcusjanssen
Snap-T

Casting from either bank, my snap T always casts very square. I can't seem to get less than about 80 degrees. What might I be doing wrong? Does anyone have any ideas?

Also, from left bank, medium to strong upstream wind- what's the best cast?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #2  
Old 08-31-2005, 03:16 PM
juro's Avatar
juro juro is offline
Coast2coast Flyfishaholic
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Steelhead country|striper coast|bonefish belt
Posts: 20,593
The snap-T is generally designed to be a square angle-change cast but it can be made at a more acute or obtuse angle depending on (1) the plane of the d-loop before the cast (2) how the pull/push is directed and (3) where the anchor lies.

Skipping the details for a minute, as long as you can lay-down this formation in a manner that it can be swept up into a d-loop, the most important thing is that the d-loop is aligned with the forward stroke - follow the 180 degree rule.

However the shape of the line on the water determines the sweeping path, and the sweeping path influences the d-loop - thus pay attention here too.

The shape of the line after the snap is a sort of 'candy cane' or "U" with 54-65 ft lines one leg ends at the rod tip and the longer leg lays on the water with only the anchor and fly upstream of you on the final casting side of the body.

Make all moves with the body, not just the arms...

a) lead the initial lift and pull toward the middle of the river a little more for closed angles

b) when pushing the rod tip underneath, cross to the inside toward the shore a bit more

c) use a shorter belly line for more maneuverability

d) pay special attention to degree of rotation at the end of the sweep - watch the d-loop!

e) wait for the sweep momentum to form the d-loop... after the stop it may take a full second for that d-loop to swell out and back

f) look for the end of the flyline to pivot before making the forward cast, this means the d-loop has formed fully

Lastly make sure the anchor and fly are on the correct side of the cast or risk a hookup of the wrong species

Upriver wind, left bank? My pet cast - the upriver snake is my favorite, but I will use a single spey most often for simplicity and power.

Good luck casting!
__________________
IFFF Certified THCI @ 2005
Capeflyfisher Guide Service
Island Hopper, Guitarist, Incurable Dreamer
and Founder, Worldwide Flyfishing Forum
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #3  
Old 08-31-2005, 09:00 PM
beau purvis beau purvis is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: B.C. ,Wa. ,Ore.
Posts: 311
Send a message via AIM to beau purvis
snap t

I like a snap t with a twist in Juro's river left ,upstream wind situation..the twist is a sidearm delivery when the wind is hard.the sidearm aspect makes evrything rollout and turnover parallel to the water surface.your leader and fly will flip around and land downstream of your line and be ready to fish without a mend.whereas, with the more normal delivery the hard wind will mostly blow the big fly and leader upriver of your line and this will require a hard messy mend.to me it is easier to do the sidearm than with a single.also easier to laydown the 2nd cast move of the snap T in a tough wind consistently.BEAU
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #4  
Old 09-01-2005, 11:20 AM
Bee Bee is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: foam lines and seams
Posts: 59
are you trying to direct the cast more upstream or more downstream?..if you are trying to get more uptream, thne try this...I am not a casting instructor and only can say this works for me in my snap t ....If you right hand is the top hand and you have snapped the line upstream and before it anchors , if you sweep the rod back and downward to the left as far possible without taking it behind you , the effect is to move the anchor in really tight to your right side and with the rod then directed upstream on the forward stroke you can direct the forward and final portion of the cast more upstream..said another way, the further the rod is swept back to the left, the more upstream shot you get on the final cast...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #5  
Old 09-01-2005, 11:27 AM
marcusjanssen marcusjanssen is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: River Spey, Scotland. River Avon, Scotland. Umzimkulu River, South Africa.
Posts: 54
Send a message via MSN to marcusjanssen
Thanks

Bee, Beau Purvis and especially Juro once again... thankyou for the tips. I'm heading down to the river over the next few days- I'll try what you have recommended.

Marcus
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #6  
Old 09-01-2005, 11:28 AM
Willie Gunn's Avatar
Willie Gunn Willie Gunn is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Spey, Deveron.Brora, Ness, Connon, Beauly
Posts: 1,096
Quote:
Originally Posted by marcusjanssen
Does anyone have any ideas?
Learn to single and double spey off both shoulders. Snap (insert letter of choice) is a cast best used in ponds and to impress wee lassies who are watching. All flash and no substance.

Quote:
Originally Posted by marcusjanssen
Also, from left bank, medium to strong upstream wind- what's the best cast?
Single Spey right hand up, next time you are at Wester Elchies ask Sam Bremner to show you.
__________________
Willie Gunn
Quot homines tot sententiae

www.speygillie.co.uk
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #7  
Old 09-01-2005, 05:23 PM
beau purvis beau purvis is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: B.C. ,Wa. ,Ore.
Posts: 311
Send a message via AIM to beau purvis
on Juro's part of the cast described under b] ,I sort of cast the line below me by puting a good bend in my rod tip and using that to propell a few feet of semi slack line as I follow through down and and around toward shore a little more than where i am standing. that way ,the line on the water ends with a half of a C shape on the downstrem half.That ,to me, is the perfect shape to retrace on the sweep back upstream. It eliminates any extra noise or tension.it is a smooth oerfect retracement.also ,I make sure my tip on that move ends in the water. So,before I start the sweep back up , all the line and the tip are on the water.If I do that every time ,the fly is anchored in the same spot above my body every time, eliminating any variation of the anchor and giving me a smooth, even ,continous build of load from the moment I start the upriver sweep prior to final delivery.By the way ,my first lift move is done with a combination of a down hand push and up hand pull and as soon as it is lifted ,the down stroke is done with a downhand pull and upper hand push combo.I dont really use any arm movement.A lot of people use big arm movements and move the whole rod.my hands and arms basically stay pretty much stable in those first two moves and I use an easy push-pull and pull-push making the top half of the rod to do all the work!Beau
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #8  
Old 09-01-2005, 07:08 PM
SSPey SSPey is offline
loco alto!
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Oregon
Posts: 97
Juro and Beau provides tons of good advice. Here's a ounce:

to cast a narrower downstream angle on the snap-T, throw the D-loop more upriver

the anchoring and body tips that Juro and Beau give will make it possible to send the line fully downstream on the final cast, 0 degrees, back to the dangle
__________________
Steve
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #9  
Old 09-01-2005, 10:55 PM
highlander2's Avatar
highlander2 highlander2 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: snoqualmie,sky,skagit,sauk
Posts: 130
Up stream wind on the left bank. You would be crazy to not use a single spey off the right shoulder, quickest way to get the fly back out and fishing. I won't discredit the snap-t as a cast its very useful with very heavy tips and a serious change of direction. But you can achieve the same with the single and use one less move to make the cast. Learn the single and it will be your best friend, practice it off both shoulders and you won't want to use a snap or a double.
__________________
Brian, drowning in newf drewl
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #10  
Old 09-02-2005, 09:09 AM
beau purvis beau purvis is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: B.C. ,Wa. ,Ore.
Posts: 311
Send a message via AIM to beau purvis
I am trying to help with ?'s asked about snap T.!! Not preaching that is the only cast to use,Not that dogmatic!! I try to use all casts.As I have said before everyone is dialed in differently and some can do some casts and others can't.All situations are different also.You cant just say 'river left.upstream wind means single spey or what ever.there can be slight differences that favor certain casts.I usually start with obvious but try other options if my first choice seems to have some less thn desired aspects.At rare times and unusual wind currents the "wrong cast" has worked best!I also just like to change and experiment to give my muscles and my brain a change.my single from river left is also a weak cast for me.I tend to do the single on river right ,upstram wind , especially when using a floating line.I use the single much more with a floating line for some reason.I find it interesting that the dogmatic ones argue against the snap T because there is an extra move required. Yet, they use the double spey in a downriver wind .you would think that that same resoning would drive them towards the snake.Must be tradition rather than efficiency!Any way thats my dribble ,for what ever it is worth!!Beau
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #11  
Old 09-02-2005, 10:03 AM
juro's Avatar
juro juro is offline
Coast2coast Flyfishaholic
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Steelhead country|striper coast|bonefish belt
Posts: 20,593
It's all good!

Beau makes and excellent point, we all have individual preferences, skillsets, goals and pleasure points. I do agree with Brian, the single is the 'one' to learn, however that wouldn't be true for all practitioners necessarily.

Years ago I started out just trying to get the damn line out there far enough. The double and snap were my saviors. Then I got consistent with the single, and my left hand came along too. Now, as funny as it seems, when the cast I am doing gets easy I switch to another cast! Call it crazy but I figure "every minute in a groove is a minute I could use to improve". If Ben Franklin was a speybrotha I'm sure he'd coin a phrase like that.

I listed the upriver snake as my favorite but by no means is it the 'best' or worst, easiest or hardest, and it won't necessarily catch more fish. It's just fun
__________________
IFFF Certified THCI @ 2005
Capeflyfisher Guide Service
Island Hopper, Guitarist, Incurable Dreamer
and Founder, Worldwide Flyfishing Forum
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #12  
Old 09-04-2005, 06:30 PM
highlander2's Avatar
highlander2 highlander2 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: snoqualmie,sky,skagit,sauk
Posts: 130
beau
was just trying to answer the original question about the best cast river left with a upstream wind. The use of the single spey in that situation is of course only my prefered method. I realize I may have came off with a thats the only way to do it attitude, my bad on that part, I know better, and keep a very open mind when it comes to casting preferences and styles as I tend to use them all.
__________________
Brian, drowning in newf drewl
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #13  
Old 09-05-2005, 12:30 AM
beau purvis beau purvis is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: B.C. ,Wa. ,Ore.
Posts: 311
Send a message via AIM to beau purvis
no problem, I was just trying to clarify I wasnt being dogmatic after Willie"s seemingly gruff retort.I really enjoy experiment and change similar to that expressed by Juro.I also am a little sensitive , since once in a while I have been tackled a little hard!!!But I am a big boy!Beau
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #14  
Old 09-05-2005, 02:11 AM
Willie Gunn's Avatar
Willie Gunn Willie Gunn is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Spey, Deveron.Brora, Ness, Connon, Beauly
Posts: 1,096
Moi gruff? what next.
There are only 2 casts to learn the single and the double spey. Left and right hand up, once you can do those well you can fish anywhere. The rest are just patter.
__________________
Willie Gunn
Quot homines tot sententiae

www.speygillie.co.uk
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #15  
Old 09-05-2005, 09:35 AM
beau purvis beau purvis is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: B.C. ,Wa. ,Ore.
Posts: 311
Send a message via AIM to beau purvis
you took my fly. I knew i would draw you back with that one.just playing with you Willie!! By the way, I caught my biggest Kharlovka fish on my first cast in my life with a Willie Gunn on a brass tube.thought of you afterwards.Beau
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Fly Fishing Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Snap-tee? Pulley? juro Pacific Northwest Sea Run Forum 7 02-20-2001 10:03 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:57 PM.



Copyright Flyfishingforum.com (All Rights Reserved)