Atlantis and Airflo WF-12-I striper line - Fly Fishing Forum
Stripers and Coastal Gamefish Stripers, Blues, Inshore tuna!

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 06-13-2004, 10:36 AM
peter-s-c peter-s-c is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Grand River, Ontario
Posts: 2,084
Atlantis and Airflo WF-12-I striper line

This was the first time out with the Atlantis + Airflo WF-12-I and I found that when I got it right, it went very well. When I didn't . . .

The problem involved the 40' head of the line. The Atlantis needed the full head out of the guides to get a decent load. If I cast with the rear taper in my hands, the cast would max out about 90'. If I let the whole head out, then I could shoot the full 105' line. The problem was, I'm short, I'm waist deep in water, I'm stripping in most of the head, so managing a long length of line got problematic.

If I was using light flies, no biggy, but using clousers, the old paranoia would creep in about the fly dropping, then I'd rush things and you all know where that goes . . . downhill.

I was really concerned about using this line on a beach with a good slope where I could only get into the water perhaps 15' to 30'. With a 2/0 hook + 10' leader + 40' of head + leaning the rod back on the drift, I'm putting a lot of line over the beach, ready to snag some unwary person out for a stroll. I had my head constantly on a swivel on the lookout. Didn't make for relaxed fishing.

I found the slippery running line was hard to hang on to with wet hands so I gave up on overhead false casting. If I continue with this line, I'd have to whip on some thread and Aquaseal it to give me some finger grips. I'd either rollcast or spey cast (if there was a current) to set up the overhead cast. It ended up pretty efficient, especially with a current, for the spey cast would shoot out the full head in one cast then I'd pick it up and blast it all out in one go. Way better than the multiple double hauls of the single hander guys. I had brought other rods but they never left their tubes. The Atlantis is the way to go for me. It really is a first class fishing tool. I tied up some of my Yak 9 pike flies in saltwater colours -- they're humungous -- and the Atlantis would toss them like a size 14 Hendrickson. I also tossed a big black bunny bug at night with Atlantis showing the same indifference.

However, I think I'd like a shorter, heavier head so I'm looking at an Airflo 13 wt. Tarpon intermediate clear line with a 34' head that has most of the weight in the front 25'. I probably would get the full load on the Atlantis with the end of the rear taper in my top hand. That'll solve a lot of problems with deep wading and narrow beaches plus it'll pickup quicker and cleaner. I just have to check the temperature range on that line.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
  #2  
Old 06-13-2004, 12:14 PM
Smolt Smolt is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Whereever silver swims
Posts: 568
But did you catch any fish?????

Smolt
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #3  
Old 06-13-2004, 12:20 PM
peter-s-c peter-s-c is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Grand River, Ontario
Posts: 2,084
We did pretty well until the north wind blew. I think I had 9 or 10 schoolies landed plus I lost a really big one (see Mustad 34007) and a semi-big one.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #4  
Old 06-13-2004, 12:23 PM
JDMuddler JDMuddler is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 16
Peter,

I found the same thing using an Airflow 45' shooting head. I'm a beginner at this two hand stuff. Casting with the full shooting head out on a football field is no problem but in the water with wind, current, etc., I found it very difficult to get the shooting head out of the water easily. I think a 35' head would suit me better, at least until I get some more experience.

John
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #5  
Old 06-13-2004, 12:57 PM
peter-s-c peter-s-c is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Grand River, Ontario
Posts: 2,084
I have the 12 wt. 35' head and it works OK on the Atlantis but I can't get the max out of the rod with it. I figure that a 100' cast is about all we would get out of it with any sort of regularity, throwing in all of the usual variables. I suppose we should be happy with that but . . .

After all of the yard work with the Atlantis, it looks like 500-550 grains is about right for the rod for my casting level. The 35' heads come in at about 450 so they're a tad light IMHO.

Perhaps Juro can step in and provide some insight.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #6  
Old 06-13-2004, 03:35 PM
DickIvers DickIvers is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Mass
Posts: 30
I was out there Friday on SB testing my new Atlantis. I would have to say the performance was not very satisfying. This was the first time I tried the rod so the shortcomings were probably my fault, as I'm only an average caster even with a single-handed rod. The setup was as follows:

Atlantis 1111A (brand new)
Airflow 12 wt. 35 ft. shooting head #3 sink
Aiflow Polyshoot XT 150 ft. running line
Fly: Welldiggers 7" eel tied on a weighted 2/0 jig hook

When I got home I did some practice casting at my little local park. This time I did some side-by-side comparison to a T&T 1212 2-hander which I also own, but have not used much.

I found I could cast about the same distance with both rods using the same line setup as above, but with no fly. I could cast about 110 ft without really trying too hard. However, the T&T seemed easier to control. It's a foot longer with slower action. There's less panic in the timing. Also, and more important I think, the line loops formed with the T&T were better shaped; sort of pretty in fact. The Atlantis would make a good loop only when the timing was perfect. Otherwise the loop at the end of the cast deterioriated into a tangled mess. No doubt this has much to do with my lack of skill, so I'll keep trying and update later.

Dick
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #7  
Old 06-13-2004, 04:05 PM
peter-s-c peter-s-c is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Grand River, Ontario
Posts: 2,084
Quote:
Originally posted by DickIvers
I was out there Friday on SB testing my new Atlantis. I would have to say the performance was not very satisfying. This was the first time I tried the rod so the shortcomings were probably my fault, as I'm only an average caster even with a single-handed rod.
Dick
Were you at the parking lot where the Rip Ryder van is usually parked? I saw one other person there with an Atlantis.

The rod seems to need a 13/14 wt. short head or 11/12 wt. long head to make it work. My Airflo Striper 12 wt. loads it beautifully but it definitely needs the full head out of the guides. If the rod is underloaded then I have to push it and I get the same ugly loops as you do. When I had the whole 12 wt. head working, it casted a very nice loop.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #8  
Old 06-13-2004, 05:38 PM
DickIvers DickIvers is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Mass
Posts: 30
Dear Peter,

Yes, that was me in the parking lot with the Atlantis.

I hope I don't have to buy a buy a bunch of new lines to make the rod work. I need to find a way to test your theory that a heavier short heads are needed. Otherwise, I'll go back to the T&T where the lines I have now seem to be OK.

BTW, the fishing stunk on SB that day as other posts have mentioned. However, my friend Bill (Fishhawk) and I later went to the Nauset back marshes where we caught a bunch of small stripers on 8 wt rods. It was welcome change in location and equipment after fighting the harsh SB elements all day.

Dick
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #9  
Old 06-13-2004, 06:51 PM
peter-s-c peter-s-c is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Grand River, Ontario
Posts: 2,084
After supper this evening, I put a little bit of masking tape on the running line, 10' beyond the rear taper so that the end of the rear taper was at the tiptop when the masking tape was at my fingertips of my top hand. I could manage 100' max. I drew the line in so that the entire rear taper was in the guides and the line was a bit easier to cast but distance didn't improve. I then left the masking tape beyond the tiptop so that I had over 10' of overhang and the casts were definitely better but not great. The clouser definitely added it share to the load.

Doing this made me realize that my best casts had come with a lot of overhang, as much as 15' or more. With the clear line, I couldn't see the end of the head but I could see whee the fly was, so it turns out that when fishing, I was aerializing way more line than I had originally thought.

John managed a couple of nice ones, Greg got a couple of blues. I had some dinks hit but I did hook up one nice fish that pulled a fair bit of line out against a cranked down drag. It popped off too, without bending the hook. Probably a mid 20's fish. That was it.

Last edited by peter-s-c; 06-13-2004 at 06:54 PM.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #10  
Old 06-14-2004, 07:40 AM
GregD's Avatar
GregD GregD is offline
2 handed Fly Chucker
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Massachusetts, Rhode Island
Posts: 638
I am going to move up to the 13wt 35ft Airflo floating shooting head for the Atlantis. I think it should load better, we'll see. I also have a hard time holding onto the polyshoot XT running line when it's wet, I use two fingers now and that helps alot. Still having more tangling issues than I think I should out of the basket as I still have some twist left on the reel. But i'm also working with over 100ft of line so I expect some of that is normal. Let us know what you think ot the 13ft tarpon taper 34ft head. I have used Tarpon line up in the Northeast without too much coiling in the colder weather. I think it will prove OK for most of you striper fishing conditions in the warmer weather.

Tight lines,
Greg.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #11  
Old 06-14-2004, 07:50 AM
peter-s-c peter-s-c is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Grand River, Ontario
Posts: 2,084
I thought Airflo's 35' heads stopped at 12 wt. If they have a 13 wt. -- I'll get that instead of the tarpon line. thanks for the heads-up.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #12  
Old 06-14-2004, 09:35 AM
juro's Avatar
juro juro is offline
Coast2coast Flyfishaholic
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Steelhead country|striper coast|bonefish belt
Posts: 20,585
Re: Atlantis and Airflo WF-12-I striper line

Peter, Dick, et. al. -

Thanks for starting this dialog, it gives me an opportunity to share some findings. Unfortunately we could not hook up in person over the weekend this time but I hope we can hook up soon.

Interestingly I see two perspectives in this overall thread: one from an experienced spey casters perspective (yours) and the other from folks having no background or need for spey casting (e.g. Dick's). I have thoughts on both views based on experiences I've had, hopefully they will be of value.

Quote:
Originally posted by peter-s-c
This was the first time out with the Atlantis + Airflo WF-12-I and I found that when I got it right, it went very well. When I didn't . . .

The problem involved the 40' head of the line. The Atlantis needed the full head out of the guides to get a decent load. If I cast with the rear taper in my hands, the cast would max out about 90'. If I let the whole head out, then I could shoot the full 105' line. The problem was, I'm short, I'm waist deep in water, I'm stripping in most of the head, so managing a long length of line got problematic.
By managing I assume you meant "lifting, rolling and aerializing the entire 40ft head between casts while wading and using a big fly". I concluded that this is what you mean because you say it casts well with the head out, and I assume we are not talking about spare line in the basket, etc.

Or perhaps you mean "getting the fat head back out again". Bigger line sizes mean bigger diameters and that means "harder to get the line back out". Conversely, using even a 45 ft high-density head rolls right out with just a flick due to diameter and grains of hi-density lines.

In either case... the shorter the head the easier the set-up, which accounts for the extreme popularity of the Teeny-style lines among striper dudes (single-handers), most notably the Cortland QD and Rio Deep Sea lines which have 26-28ft heads. A 30 or 35ft head is much easier to set-up between casts with the 11fter, although the longer heads have distance casting advantages.

The shorter heads will hold a loop form for about 80 feet then the energy wave passes through the leader and dissipates into thin air before the cast is completed, causing the tension in the line to expire, thus the head will flail about like a hose without a sprinkler.

Case in point: Thousands of striper anglers fish the Cortland 325 QD on their 9ft 9wt rods. Watch as they cast them beautifully with little effort for 70-90ft. Then a pod of fish comes by and they need to reach. Once they break the 100ft mark the energy needed to throw that cast causes the loop to run out before it completes and the line lands in a dumped curve.

Two-handed rods make it easy to exceed that limit - so although short lines set up easier between casts they often can't hold the loop form for the length of the casts possible with the tool.

We need a line that can (a) set up comfortably between casts (b) load the rod effectively and (c) not lose it's loop form over serious distances.

In comparison, Spey lines and rods comfortably balance what they can "manage" or what I would call "set-up" against what they can cast comfortably. Anything extra comes from shooting. They are longer and have a different flex profile to accomodate this.

Overhead rods (i.e. single handers and new two-handers) can hold in the air more than they can comfortably setup. For instance if we tried putting the 40ft head on a single hander capable of handling that many grains in the air, it would be even harder to "manage" but would cast the line just fine.

Thus, IMHO the caster must adopt different techniques for setting up between casts, or else use spey casting gear on the beach which introduces a whole new set of problems due to unnecessary length, slower actions, stripping / hooking and landing fish, etc.

Again, roll out is really easy with a sinking head portion due to density and grains, in fact you can effortlessly roll cast out an entire 45ft high density head from the leader knot to the back taper once you get into the high density ranges (DI-7 Airflo for instance).

Technique:

1) Regardless of head length, find the length of line that manages (sets up between casts) very comfortably. This should be at the back taper or within the belly depending on length/grains, or else the line might be too light.

It's possible in fact probable that if you stand a comfortable distance from the waves you can actually cast better and make up for the difference over wading out. Note that the "comfortable length of line" will vary with the depth you wade and the height of the angler just as it does with spey casting or single hand casting.

2) getting the head out:

I start with a sideways sweep "side-slip" like a spey cast but lower, letting the line stick while I slip line out through my fingers on the way back. By rising to a high 1 o'clock position, I now have slid quite a length of line out of the guides. This should get at least 10-15 feet out, even more in current or waves. Then I squeeze and roll the line forward, shooting the balance to the back taper laying the line straight and ready to lift into the backcast. If the first "sideslip" got some line out, the second shooting roll (switch) is more than adequate to get a 30, 35, even 45 ft head out there. You might even have to hold back a little. Better yet, start the whole sequence with a poke/wiggle forward before coming back to slipslide, then a shoot roll.

3) other hints:

With a clear intermediate line you don't need more than a 4-6ft leader. With a sinking line, you don't need more than a 4-6ft leader if you can get head-on angles, blind or sighted. So you don't need a spey leader for stripers unless you're fishing a bright floating line. These are rumbling linebackers of the brine, not the king of fish although I completely love and admire them so. They are awesome but not line shy in the surf or rips where this rod is designed to be used, only on the flats does leader stealth matter. So choke up and let the grains do the work.

If there is current, like a tidal inlet, I use a snake roll-like motion to setup the forward roll to get the head out for the lift into the backcast. A circle spey also pulls up a huge amount of sunk line in rip currents.

Use the side slip and the shooting roll to get the head out, straight, and ready for the lift into the backcast.

Bring your favorite spey rod out on the beach and cast them side by side with the Atlantis for a day. Casting is only one part of the equation! Besides superior set-up with the spey, I'd be curious to hear the other fishing characteristics you notice thru the day between the two rods. I've fished the spey action rods on the beach for years and could give you a long list. People who spend time out there with the spey action rods often concur with my findings as well - too long, too flexible, to hard to strip, too hard to set and land fish. The Atlantis is only about 8 inches longer from grip to tip than the standard 9ft'er, making it a good fishing tool as well as a more powerful casting tool.

[b]
Quote:
If I was using light flies, no biggy, but using clousers, the old paranoia would creep in about the fly dropping, then I'd rush things and you all know where that goes . . . downhill.

I was really concerned about using this line on a beach with a good slope where I could only get into the water perhaps 15' to 30'. With a 2/0 hook + 10' leader + 40' of head + leaning the rod back on the drift, I'm putting a lot of line over the beach, ready to snag some unwary person out for a stroll. I had my head constantly on a swivel on the lookout. Didn't make for relaxed fishing.
It's great that you are concerned about strollers, considerate anglers will keep legislators from shutting down beach access and the general public friendly about anglers on public beaches, etc. Good point.

If a 40ft head is a threat just imagine what a single handed overhead cast (30-40ft head aerialized to 60-70ft false casts) would do to the poor passersby, or worse yet a spey line cast overhead (short heads 54ft, long heads over 100ft).

Most beaches I fish I stand about up to my shins in the surfline, which is almost dry between waves. By standing back, clearing the beach is much easier and with the right lines I don't feel like I am missing on on too much by standing back because I am still casting past the single-handed anglers taking waves in the face.

Quote:
I found the slippery running line was hard to hang on to with wet hands so I gave up on overhead false casting. If I continue with this line, I'd have to whip on some thread and Aquaseal it to give me some finger grips. I'd either rollcast or spey cast (if there was a current) to set up the overhead cast. It ended up pretty efficient, especially with a current, for the spey cast would shoot out the full head in one cast then I'd pick it up and blast it all out in one go. Way better than the multiple double hauls of the single hander guys. I had brought other rods but they never left their tubes. The Atlantis is the way to go for me. It really is a first class fishing tool. I tied up some of my Yak 9 pike flies in saltwater colours -- they're humungous -- and the Atlantis would toss them like a size 14 Hendrickson. I also tossed a big black bunny bug at night with Atlantis showing the same indifference.
I'm glad you found the rod effective out there. I hope you hook a 40plus incher so you can feel the other benefit of having a more powerful rod out there

For slipping of line in the hands, I have come up with a grip style that really helps. Grasp the handle and make a middle finger with the rod in hand. Place the line under the middle finger, then close it. This puts the line against three fingers and dramatically reduces slip. Also, hold the line with the bottom hand for a safety catch. The line can be slipped right through the middle finger grip by lightening and squeezing, then shot by lifting the finger off the handle as the loop flies forward.

Quote:
However, I think I'd like a shorter, heavier head so I'm looking at an Airflo 13 wt. Tarpon intermediate clear line with a 34' head that has most of the weight in the front 25'. I probably would get the full load on the Atlantis with the end of the rear taper in my top hand. That'll solve a lot of problems with deep wading and narrow beaches plus it'll pickup quicker and cleaner. I just have to check the temperature range on that line.
Sounds like a good line to try, please keep us posted.

There are new lines coming that I am hoping will simplify this process. I am very optimistic that a current project by a major line maker will be what we are looking for.

Final note:

Deep wading and stripping to the leader butt has not been something I've had to do with the Atlantis because I use it primarily for surf and big rips. In surf, I stand back out of the messy stuff and fire high and far. This means I leave more line out between casts as I stand back further. It's much more comfortable, drier and safer than trying for the extra distance in the waves, taking them in the face.

In rips I use more swing so the line is left out longer between casts, even allowing spey techniques to set up. I particularly like the snake and or circle to set things up.

On the flats, I could go either way. If the fish are jammin' me it's nicer to have the Speytracker (9' 8" 8wt) which can cast either way, or my trusty single hander. But if the fish are running the edge of the channels at high tide or a vicious cross-wind is blowing on my favorite flat I find I have a major advantage on the flats with an Atlantis while sight fishing.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #13  
Old 06-14-2004, 10:03 AM
juro's Avatar
juro juro is offline
Coast2coast Flyfishaholic
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Steelhead country|striper coast|bonefish belt
Posts: 20,585
Hi Dick -

Thanks for the feedback, comments below.

Quote:
Originally posted by DickIvers
I was out there Friday on SB testing my new Atlantis. I would have to say the performance was not very satisfying. This was the first time I tried the rod so the shortcomings were probably my fault, as I'm only an average caster even with a single-handed rod. The setup was as follows:

Atlantis 1111A (brand new)
Airflow 12 wt. 35 ft. shooting head #3 sink
Aiflow Polyshoot XT 150 ft. running line
Fly: Welldiggers 7" eel tied on a weighted 2/0 jig hook

When I got home I did some practice casting at my little local park. This time I did some side-by-side comparison to a T&T 1212 2-hander which I also own, but have not used much.

I found I could cast about the same distance with both rods using the same line setup as above, but with no fly. I could cast about 110 ft without really trying too hard. However, the T&T seemed easier to control. It's a foot longer with slower action. There's less panic in the timing. Also, and more important I think, the line loops formed with the T&T were better shaped; sort of pretty in fact. The Atlantis would make a good loop only when the timing was perfect. Otherwise the loop at the end of the cast deterioriated into a tangled mess. No doubt this has much to do with my lack of skill, so I'll keep trying and update later.

Dick
What causes the loop to "deteriorate into a tangle mess" is that the power wedge in the loop passes right through the line and recoils in midair, having lost it's shape. That would lead me to believe you are putting a lot of power into that line with the Atlantis, perhaps a little too much.

In talking to those who were involved with the design of that 12x12, they call it a "12 ft 10wt". So I have to assume that because it's a lighter, longer rod it is being loaded more deeply and giving you a slower feel. This comparison is in a way like saying a line that loads the Surf-tamer over-lines the T&T.

It's a major problem that two-handed lines/rod ratings are not very streamlined. In fact if the Surf-tamer was a spey action rod it would probably be a 8/9/10 because of the differences in the line ratings (grains over head length) althought the actions are completely different.

But there is no right or wrong, the line that makes each rod feel it's best might not be the same line and people have different preferences.

For the 'prettiest' cast on the Atlantis I prefer the Hardy Mach I which is a 50+ ft head but weighs 638 grains and is a thing of beauty to cast. Only the floater is pleasant to set up between casts, as 50+ ft of sunk line is never a pleasure on any rod. I am pretty sure it will overload the T&T.

I tend to fish the 30-35ft lengths the most for a nice blend of factors. Sets up easy, aerializes and shoots nicely although it's not as easy to hold the loop shape as long as the 50+ft heads.

I hope the next generation of 2-handed lines brings out the best of two-handed coastal flyfishing.

One thing is certain, I can not imagine fishing the surf with a single hander anymore!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #14  
Old 06-14-2004, 10:55 AM
peter-s-c peter-s-c is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Grand River, Ontario
Posts: 2,084
Re: Re: Atlantis and Airflo WF-12-I striper line

Quote:
Originally posted by juro
By managing I assume you meant "lifting, rolling and aerializing the entire 40ft head between casts while wading and using a big fly". I concluded that this is what you mean because you say it casts well with the head out, and I assume we are not talking about spare line in the basket, etc.
My routine was to strip in all but about 20' of head then rollcast, Snap-T, or DS the full head out, then pick up and blast. I was waist deep either on the edge of a flat or an inside or bay beach with little wave action. I tried Nausett Beach twice at dusk, and like you, I kept my tootsies on the high side of the surf line.

Just to reflect on the two-hander vs. single-hander world, often I'd screw up by pulling in more of the head than I intended, and sometimes on purpose when the schoolies were in close. I'd then need two rollcasts, one to work out a bit of head and the second to complete the setup. Sometimes the first roll would get most of the head out so the second went out with real energy and I'd lose my grip on the line. Down would plop a 70+' roll or spey cast and I'd whine and moan to myself how stupid I was at losing the grip -- till I realized that my blown setup casts were going further than some single handers were tossing line on the double haul.

My recent yard tests had made me realize that sometimes I was aerializing as much as 60' plus 10' of leader. If I didn't screw up, those were my best casts.

Quote:

In either case... the shorter the head the easier the set-up, which accounts for the extreme popularity of the Teeny-style lines among striper dudes (single-handers), most notably the Cortland QD and Rio Deep Sea lines which have 26-28ft heads. A 30 or 35ft head is much easier to set-up between casts with the 11fter, although the longer heads have distance casting advantages.

The shorter heads will hold a loop form for about 80 feet then the energy wave passes through the leader and dissipates into thin air before the cast is completed, causing the tension in the line to expire, thus the head will flail about like a hose without a sprinkler.
Good point about head length and distance -- it's a relationship that I often forget. My yard tests have shown me that I had been handling far longer lengths than I had known at the time.

Quote:

We need a line that can (a) set up comfortably between casts (b) load the rod effectively and (c) not lose it's loop form over serious distances.
We forget (at least I do) that we're casting lines designed for single handers and not these big two-handers. The Airflo 45' heads are probably the best compromise between these factors when you need to work long and the 35' heads when working short and/or wading deep. Looking forward to hearing about that line manufacturer's project.

Quote:

Technique:

1) Regardless of head length, find the length of line that manages (sets up between casts) very comfortably. This should be at the back taper or within the belly depending on length/grains, or else the line might be too light.


This is what I was attemtping to do but my poor control over the running line grip made this problematic.

Quote:

It's possible in fact probable that if you stand a comfortable distance from the waves you can actually cast better and make up for the difference over wading out. Note that the "comfortable length of line" will vary with the depth you wade and the height of the angler just as it does with spey casting or single hand casting.


Yup, after a while, I figured that this was a good trade-off.

Quote:

2) getting the head out:

I start with a sideways sweep "side-slip" like a spey cast but lower, letting the line stick while I slip line out through my fingers on the way back. By rising to a high 1 o'clock position, I now have slid quite a length of line out of the guides. This should get at least 10-15 feet out, even more in current or waves. Then I squeeze and roll the line forward, shooting the balance to the back taper laying the line straight and ready to lift into the backcast. If the first "sideslip" got some line out, the second shooting roll (switch) is more than adequate to get a 30, 35, even 45 ft head out there. You might even have to hold back a little. Better yet, start the whole sequence with a poke/wiggle forward before coming back to slipslide, then a shoot roll.


Yup, got this part working OK, except for the grip bit.

Quote:

3) other hints:

With a clear intermediate line you don't need more than a 4-6ft leader. With a sinking line, you don't need more than a 4-6ft leader if you can get head-on angles, blind or sighted. So you don't need a spey leader for stripers unless you're fishing a bright floating line. These are rumbling linebackers of the brine, not the king of fish although I completely love and admire them so. They are awesome but not line shy in the surf or rips where this rod is designed to be used, only on the flats does leader stealth matter. So choke up and let the grains do the work.


I thought I might be working with too long a leader, it does complicate the setup.

Quote:

I'm glad you found the rod effective out there. I hope you hook a 40plus incher so you can feel the other benefit of having a more powerful rod out there


I think I did -- read my Mustad 34007 post.

Quote:

For slipping of line in the hands, I have come up with a grip style that really helps. Grasp the handle and make a middle finger with the rod in hand. Place the line under the middle finger, then close it. This puts the line against three fingers and dramatically reduces slip. Also, hold the line with the bottom hand for a safety catch. The line can be slipped right through the middle finger grip by lightening and squeezing, then shot by lifting the finger off the handle as the loop flies forward.


I finally did worked this grip out on my own, but my trout/spey reflexes kept doing me in as I'd completely release the line on the setup rather than just let it slip -- this is just the old muscle memory issue.

As far as lines go, I haven't decided yet but either I could go with the tarpon 13 wt. or just complete my set of 45' - 12 wt. heads. The Airflo 12 wt. striper line is a keeper but I have to do some refining of technique to get the best out of it. I hit enough big casts with it to know how works best. It's just a matter of getting reliable with it. A set of 35' and 45' heads might work best as I can switch them around to suit the circumstances.

Keep in mind that my Atlantis will also get used for northerns, musky, GL chinook, and perhaps some Niagara River work so I'm trying to put together a line setup that covers the most bases.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
  #15  
Old 06-14-2004, 11:47 AM
juro's Avatar
juro juro is offline
Coast2coast Flyfishaholic
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Steelhead country|striper coast|bonefish belt
Posts: 20,585
Very impressive and thanks for the line feedback Peter! Now I am off to read about this big fish... outcome sounded bad but the process sounded exciting!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Fly Fishing Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Airflo Striper or 40 + Cold Saltwater Line starsky Gear Talk - Fly Stuff Spoken Here 14 12-01-2010 11:25 AM
FS: Airflo striper line WF-12-I peter-s-c Stripers and Coastal Gamefish 0 07-02-2005 03:07 PM
AirFlo Line FishHawk Stripers and Coastal Gamefish 6 04-02-2001 08:23 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:32 PM.



Copyright Flyfishingforum.com (All Rights Reserved)