Fluoro untying? - Fly Fishing Forum
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Old 08-06-2007, 08:06 AM
South Shore South Shore is offline
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Fluoro untying?

Went fishing last night and had a few bits on a wooly bugger, the most frustrating one being during the retrieve and I felt a pretty solid Whack! I paused for a second, pretty sure I set the hook on the retrieve. When I saw a good-size silver flash in the water I raised the rod to start the fight. However, one good tug and he was gone.

I brought the line in... and no bugger. It looked like it had untied, not snapped. There was a tight curl at the end that I think was where the knot had been. I had been using a Frog Hair leader, which I was told had some stretch to it unlike most fluoro leaders, and that I didn't need to leave much of a tag end. Is it likely that it untied? I was using an Improved Clinch Knot, with maybe 4 loops around the main line while tying.

I'm thinking I either need more loops around the main line, a longer tag end (I probably about 2mm max), or I didn't raise the rod fast enough and let him yank on it while I was holding the line in my line hand and didn't realize how much pressure I had on the fish. Any ideas?
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Old 08-06-2007, 08:18 AM
BigDave BigDave is offline
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Try 6 turns on that clinch knot.

Usually the dreaded pigtail is a sign that the knot was knot tightened all the way.
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Old 08-06-2007, 10:17 AM
South Shore South Shore is offline
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Thanks! I started giving it a couple more turns but all I got the rest of the night were a couple tiny bass on some dry flies. Not much of a challenge there.

It was just killing me though, that silver flash I saw was a good 15 inches long if not more and I have yet to pull in a trout on my fly rod.
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Old 08-06-2007, 10:37 AM
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juro juro is offline
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Also consider stronger knots for light tippets like the palomar for instance.
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Old 08-06-2007, 11:51 AM
South Shore South Shore is offline
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Good to know. I thought the Palomar was actually weaker under a certain loading condition - maybe when shocked? I was using 2X with the Bugger though, so I don't think that would be considered light tippet... correct?
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Old 08-06-2007, 01:08 PM
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juro juro is offline
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I doubt if a palomar is weaker than a clinch under any circumstances (except faulty execution of the knot). Do some experimentation and see what you find out, I speak from my experiences only and people have different paths through the FF world.

I used to fish trout as a top target species. Frustration over lost trout on super-light tippets is actually what drove me to using the palomar when I was a teen. The difference was profound for me using the same tippet. They could pop the tippet but not the knot.

Doubling the single strand around the hook eye (like the palomar does) makes the clinch a stronger knot. I think they call it the trilene knot or something. I prefer the palomar, much easier to tie.

I have been a winter steelhead junkie for decades, in these presentations a fly ends up in the rocks fairly often. It's pretty clear that a palomar is a stronger knot when you are pulling out from a rockpile.

Other knots are more suited to applications despite possible loss of knot strength, like the non-slip loop which imparts better action to certain flies but needs to be checked and re-tied to keep it strong enough; the turle and double turle are great for loop eye salmon / steelhead hooks and snelling a tippet is a great way to tie hooks for trailers (e.g. coho salmon flies).
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