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pmflyfisher 12-25-2001 11:02 AM

Where are the Atlantic Salmon Fisherman ?
I have been on the forumn for about 5 weeks now.

Just wondering where all the atlantic salmon fly fisherman are ?

Being a former east coast fly fisherman, now in the midwest it appears they have all converted to east coast salt water fishing, form the number of salt fly anglers on this board.

Also wonder where all the trout fisherman are ?

Demographics of the people on the forumn appear to be primarily east coast salt water and PNW steelhead.

Need a forumn demographics poll, will put that together over holiday.

Merry Christmas to all !!


John Desjardins 12-26-2001 09:48 AM

Re: Where are the Atlantic Salmon Fisherman ?

Originally posted by pmflyfisher
I have been on the forumn for about 5 weeks now.

Just wondering where all the atlantic salmon fly fisherman are ?

Also wonder where all the trout fisherman are ?

I'll give you my opinion on these two questions.

For many of us in the northeast US atlantic salmon are thought of as an exotic destination fish. To fish for them, even on public waters, takes a considerable outlay of time, travel and capital with a low likelyhood of success. This limits the number of people who chase them. The striped bass on the other hand is catchable along most of the coast allowing people to fit in a couple of hours here & there fishing, rather than thinking about fishing.

I'm one of those who is mostly a trout/warm water fisherman. One of the things I've noticed the last couple of years is that, aside from on a few tailwaters, I see very few fly fisherman on fresh water from mid May to late October. Granted the streams are too warm for trout C&R for a portion of that time, but the decrease in the number of freshwater fly fisherman is noticable durring that period. My opinion is that most fly fisherman are chasing the stripers.

Adrian 12-26-2001 10:22 AM

That would be true in my case John. I used to go for Atlantics a couple of weeks a year back in th UK.

Vacation days being a lot less over here, I head out to warmer climes and chase stripers during the summer.

One New Years resolution is to join TU and support the restoration efforts on the Naugatuck river.

I don't think I'll go after the hatchery reared fish but, one day, someone will connect with a bright silver bar and bring the first sea winter Atlantic to hand.

Now that will get me out on the river!

wrke 12-26-2001 11:02 AM

Here's one salmon fisherman (I just registered a few days ago). I fish them twice a year, once in late June on the Gaspé, once in late September or early October in northern New Brunswick. June affords me salmon on dead drift dries, fall gives me gorgeous maple colors. And although I live in the Finger Lakes region of New York, I consider the North Umpqua to be my home steelhead river. I've fished it for over 25 years. I participated in the steelhead project with the Wild Salmon Center in Kamchatka in 1996. My trout fishing happens here in NY, on a limited basis, and my wife and I have traveled to Montana every year for about 30 years. We also trout fish in Idaho. I do a little bonefishing and tarpon fishing every year. Absolutely love atlantic salmon, and would like to spend more time in the PNW with the west coast version (mykiss, not feral salmo).


pmflyfisher 12-26-2001 12:23 PM

Welcome Bill, I have only been on the board since mid November you will find mostly east coast saltwater and PNW steelheaders. I myself grew up in Northern NJ, learned to fly fish when 12 years old in the Catskill rivers, Beaverkill, Willowemuc, etc... About 42 years experience now. Then was transferred to mid west in 1979 from NYC to Chicago area. Been fishing Michigan trout, steelhead (mainly, and pacific salmon here in the great lakes since. One of my objectives is to get to the N. Umpqua looks beautiful and very challenging river, but have to get it on my fly fishing accomplishments list. When I left the east coast was just getting into Atlantic salmon fishing in Maine. Steelhead have replaced them though for now. There are some Atlantic salmon in the great lakes but very limited fly fishing on one river I will keep unnamed. Perhaps we should do an atlantic salmon fly swap. Many of the patterns can be used for steelhead. I tied up some atlantic salmon patterns recently for potential use on steelhead.

Well any way welcome to the board and perhaps we can get the Atlantic salmon threads rolling on this board.

Happy Holidays !!


Willie Gunn 12-26-2001 01:44 PM

Hi Pmflyfisher
I do not really count being in Scotland but I am only Atlantic Salmon. I do not fish for anything else bar seatrout in the summer. I hate this time of year as there is nothing happening and I have all these days off and no fishing to do. Back to work tommorrow. Then look forward to Janurary 15 when the season reopens.


pmflyfisher 12-26-2001 01:51 PM

Oh no Scotland !!

Been surfing some of the salmon web sites over there over the holiday. Looks very excellent the fishing. But is there much public water for the normal person to fish their. That appears to me the big draw back to fishing in Europe to us americans. Everything appears private or you must pay. I know there is some public water but not like here in the US. Got to get back to the UK on business this year and try and sneak in some salmon fishing. My problem our home office is in Zurich, Switzerland which is here I would probably end up and there is no atlantic salmon there, just some trout and grayling, which does not get me going to lug all of the tackle, etc.. Atlantic salmon though are a different story.

If we find some more salmon fisherman we should do a fly swap. I can do hairwings forget the classics I am not up to that level of patience or skill yet.

Which salmon rivers do you fish over there ?

Best Regards,

Hal Eckert

Chicago, IL

Willie Gunn 12-26-2001 02:24 PM

Hi Hal
Yes you are right most of the water is privately owned. There are some association/public water but this is not free. I fish the Beauly,Brora, Connon, Deveron, Ness, and Spey. You will recognise the last two as everyone in the states seem to be well up on Grant the Wizzard of the Ness. The Deveron is a neighbour of the Spey 20 miles to the east. The Beauly Connon and Brora are all north of Inverness the first two are Hydro electric dammed rivers and are timeshare. The Brora is a classic highland river.

The Deveron enters the sea at my home town of Banff and I am lucky enough to rent a private stretch for the entire season. It is just a short length and unfortunately single bank. But it is very pleasent to be able to go up fishing anytime I feel like it.

Both the Ness and the Spey have excellent associatin water, which although not free are excellent value for money.


fredaevans 12-26-2001 02:34 PM

"Beat fees."
Good morning Doc. Glad you brought up 'fee fishing.' Zero sense of scale but what's the range of cost to rent water on the rivers you mentioned?

ps: Has my 'mail' arrived yet?

pmflyfisher 12-26-2001 02:35 PM


The only one of those rivers I have heard of is the Spey, I wonder why ? What is the salmon season over there ?

By the way I do not know of any rivers in the US where you have to pay to fish the water. There are some private trout lakes and with maybe a few streams on them, but overall everything here is open to the public. Some rivers though the land is private and you must float it and stay in the water while fishing in these sections.

I would not mind paying for some of these quality waters if the number of fisherman could be mitigated though.


fisshman26 12-26-2001 02:58 PM

I dont know if it still exists, but there used to be a pay section on the Salmon river in new york.

pmflyfisher 12-26-2001 03:40 PM

Could be, heard there are a lot fish in the Salmon and just as many fisherman, big crowds since I think that is the closest salmon and steelhead stream to the east coast cities. My friends from NYC area have been up there. Not me though. Glad the Michigan rivers are out of easy driving distance from east coast cities. Mainly Detroit,, Chicago, some Ohio and Indiana fisherman also drive up for them. No pay fishing areas in Michigan on their riivers. I wonder if the PNW has any private pay areas on trout or steelhead, salmon rivers. What about BC ?

Willie Gunn 12-26-2001 04:05 PM

Salmon seasons vary, the Ness Beauly open Jan 15 and close Oct 15. Spey starts Feb11 and closes Sept 30 the Deveron starts Feb11 but closes Oct31.

Prices vary depending on supply and demand the best weeks on the best beats can cost up to £1000/ week $1490 ? I think. There is plenty of good quality fishing at more reasonable prices. The advantage of paying is that there is no one else on your pool or pools. On the Spey you can be given two pools to fish in the morning then another two in the afternoon, and if it is single bank you have the place to yourself and the wildlife. Remember our island is just little with a high population. The Brora I pay £250 for my June week. Time share is something else, the Beauly charge up to £70,000 / rod/ week but it is for ever, and can be passed on to your heirs etc, but bear in mind that there is a mamagement fee over and above this. That is for a prime week in July where there are over 100 fish caught, between 12 anglers. Roughly a fish a day each. There always a lot of arguement for and against timeshare, I own about three weeks but none of them are prime weeks but hard working fishers can take fish in the cheap weeks :D

I pay £1000 / season to fish my little stretch on the Deveron mind you it is only 0.25 mile long.

Sorry Fred parcel has not arrived but the post here is awful at this time of the year. Looking forward to the post in the new year.


saltRon 12-26-2001 04:27 PM

Pay To Fish
In the province of BC. we have a few so called destination lakes that are privately controlled ad do charge a fee for fishing rites and accomodation. The costs are not out of site considering the quality of fish to be taken and the suroundings. We do have a classification of waters primarly rivers that fall under a heading Classified waters Class 1 & 2 which will cost the resident angler an additional $10.00 annually and the non resident $ 10.00 or $20.00 a day to fish to preserve the unique opportunities these areas offer.

On the subject of Atlantic Salmon we have a few 100,000 escapes that we would love to have you come catch.

Happy Holidays saltRon

pmflyfisher 12-26-2001 04:27 PM


Thanks for the insights. They are some very long salmon seasons. Are there really fish for that long in the rivers which are worth pursuing. In Michigan the andramous fish season is 12 months, all year on most rivers, but I would say only 8 months September to April there are enough fish to pursue them with probability of success.

When you say single bank that means only one fisherman per pool ? Dual bank means two fisherman per pool I suppose that have reserved that section of river.

I guess they do not allow floating the rivers over there, like they do in the states. Here if you are floating in the water you can fish just about any river section. Landowners only own up to the high water mark of the river in many states. In some they own up to the water edge and the land you stand on in the river. On those you can fish from a canoe, but not standing in the river within their land boundaries.

To summarize in the states if you are floating the river and do not set foot on the land while within their property boundaries you are OK.

I wish some of my favorite river sections would go to pay to fish to keep the traffic down.

Best Regards,

Hal Eckert

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