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Topic Review (Newest First)
06-13-2000 05:24 PM
juro
RE:Spey and two-handed discussion board!

Eric -

That's a great time to visit. You'll be well taken care of when you come out, I look forward to it!

Juro
06-05-2000 09:18 AM
Bourger
RE:Spey and two-handed discussion board!

Ok, looks we're totally away from the initial subject!

I will arrive in Boston on Aug 28, spend that night with my relatives then drive down the next day, that's the 29th, a Tuesday if I'm right. I'll probably spend two nights in the area then head back to Boston on the 31st. I'll check the website you mentioned. Thanks again!
06-05-2000 08:19 AM
juro
RE:Spey and two-handed discussion board!

You can probably get a little lower per night for lodging, but not much more. Yarmouth is mid-cape and although not totally polarized into one region or another, it's a fair drive to anywhere other than the Nantucket Sound beaches or Brewster Flats. All in all, it's a very good location for someone who plans to "fish around". Also, I am in the next town over so it will work out well for me to show you around.

I did a little looking around since you first asked and researched some of the nicer places in the area - none of them are under $100.

Pete L. - how much was that place in Yarmouth?
Ken J. - how about the two places you stayed?

Camping:

YES! Wonderful camping at Nickerson State Park in Brewster, www.reserveamerica.com to register on-line. Also a good location for fishing from the outer beaches, Brewster flats, southside beaches, Monomoy, etc.

What are your visit dates again? (sorry to ask again)
06-05-2000 06:49 AM
Bourger
RE:Spey and two-handed discussion board!

Hi Juro,

Can't wait to try your modified two-hander (Do you cast all that line in a regular two-handed overhead cast?)! Actually I have two problems bringing that Sage 11'3": primo I co-own the rod with a buddy (he's the one that uses it most, performs better with it, too!!) and secundo he's off to Ireland (Atlantic Salmon) this summer and wants to take it along. If for some reason I manage to get it, it'll be in my luggage.

Other question, other subject: What is a reasonable rate for a night in a motel or so on the Cape. I have managed to find a place in Yarmouth at about 80 bucks a night, that was low end! Is there any website advertising rooms for rental you know of. I was browsing the ones you find with search tools, but those are not in my budget (anymore!). Say are there any campgrounds that are worth mentioning, since I can bring a tent?

Third question: shall I bring my 12-weight rod? What lines are used most of the time? Slime line monocores?

Hope to hear from you soon,
06-01-2000 09:15 PM
juro
RE:Spey and two-handed discussion board!

Say are you bringing the Sage 11'3" 8-9 wt?? I haven't seen that one and as you know they are no longer in production. I'd imagine that at that length they would be sweet to comparison cast with other two-handers.

To respond to your question, we still are trying to determine if a short two-handed rod can meet the striper fishing needs while avoiding the issues of longer rods (mentioned above).

So far, we have both a modified and an off the shelf Sage 8wt 12'4" 3 pc rod. The modified rod has been shortened. It easily casts 80 feet of 12 wt line and occasionally puts out a whole 12wt intermediate but isn't quite automatic to throw the whole line. Perhaps a setup like you mention would be an appropriate test? I've tried a hybrid head system (multi-tip) I built for steelhead and it casts very well but I would not make a 'tip' line my main striper line.

The season starting after the Monomoy Clave will be focused on Outer Beach fishing with these new rods. I'll be updating the story on the main homepage accordingly through the season.

Please bring that 11'3" 8/9 Sage two-hander if you can!!!
05-31-2000 06:43 AM
Bourger
RE:Spey and two-handed discussion board!

Greetings Juro,

First of all thanks again for all advice you provide.

I see you're pretty much interested in gear, especially rods. Frankly, I'm a rod and casting freak always looking for the ultimate casting and fishing tool.
Using short two handed rods the way you describe it is kind of new to me, even though I have used shorter twohanders, but only of classic manufacture, i.e. slow blanks in moderate line sizes (up to 9 weight). All those rods had one thing in common: At the beginning I had great trouble heaving out (controlling a long line) decent amounts of line due to their "slow" action (Sage 11'3" 8-9 wt.). Before I forget it, we cast those rods one handed! Using shooting heads (DT lines cut in half or using 2/3 of a DT line and spliced onto flat beam running line)I somewhat managed to get along with it, but I don't like using shooting heads too much, neither do I like the soft actions. We use(d) this setup on some artificial lakes here in Europe on special occasions to make long (up to 130 ft) casts with all kinds of flies but mostly small dry flies to cruising fish (no boats allowed). In windy conditions I had great trouble laying out my (long) leader over those long distances, so I'd rather used a fast-action SP+ 8-wt. for better line control but shorter casts, though. Achieving important distances with that setup cast twohanded seems to be kind of impossible.

My questions now: Is there a short twohander that actually can throw a long line under windy conditions and that is a great fighting tool as well? The Sage rod we have is fine for all fishing up to bigger salmon but I doubt the blank has the backbone to beat strong winds and handle any strong saltwater fish especially from a boat. I might be wrong, having never fished for striped bass, though. I'm looking forward to use that magic wand!
05-30-2000 10:51 PM
juro
Spey and two-handed discussion board!

If you're interested in Spey rods and two-handed overhead casting rods, ya gotta check out
<!--http--><a href="http://communities.msn.ca/InternationalSpeyCasting" target="_blank">Dana's way cool Spey casting site!</a><!--url-->

I made this post there in case it is of interest... much MUCH more on his great BB!

----- attached post -----

Great thread.... Nice to recognize so many folks too. As a steelie Spey addict recently transplanted to the northeast's striper country, I am also doing some research in this area. Although the line control and Spey casting capabilities of the long rods are the ultimate on steelie (salmon) rivers, I couldn't get comfortable with my any of my several Spey rods in the pounding Cape Cod surf for a number of reasons and have acquired European two-handers. Sage still maintains that initial pioneering spirit despite their success, and have been gracious enough to help through this research.

As the season is getting underway, the testing is finally getting going after the long new england winter. Look for field reports on http://www.flyfishingforum.com over the next few months. The reason I like shorter two-handed rods for the application of striped bass and other atlantic coastal species is:

a) General retrieve mechanics are to hold the rod with one hand, and strip retrieve with the other leaving the rod stationary and directed low to the water and toward the fly. Although the casting is so much easier with 14-16 feet, the operative 'fishing' is not. The strip retrieve requires bringing the whole fly line into the guides because the fish follow right to the end of the retrieve. A softer 15 foot rod is less than ideal for this because it can be top heavy and awkward in the rod hand. Just think of starting your Spey cast without the operative line length out of the guides for every cast... OK you get it. You do tuck the lower handle under the armpit, but a shorter rod is a much better strip retrieve / general fishing tool. I like 12 feet but would be happier if it were even shorter to be suitable for use on a ...

b) ... Boat. One of the great things about SWFF is the use of a boat. When fishing from a 16 ft skiff, I personally wouldn't use a rod that is as long as the boat - yet the two-handed advantage for huge lines and flies as well as fatigue free casting and fighting of large fish with a nice extension handle is something that would be very nice in a hard running offshore rip with foot long squid flies and 500 grain lines. Try that with one arm for a whole tide change!

c) Outer beaches often have a lot of flotsam and wind. Dealing with removal of 'mung' from flies is somewhat of a comedy when the wind is blowing and you are too far from the tip of the rod, cast after cast.

e) Landing the fish... it's just not the same as the ritual of bringing that hard-earned steelhead or salmon to the rivers edge. The surf is pounding with a wash that can suck a grown man into the current. Small fish (under 24") can be mixed in with a blitz of big fish (40") and the whole opportunity can be measured in minutes or even seconds. You want to be able to get at a fish quickly for removal at times, schoolie after schoolie with the sound of big cow bass busting the surface around. It's frustrating to have to mess around with too much fulcrum.

I could go on and on. My opinion, for what it's worth, is that folks think two-hands and automatically go 14 feet / Spey rod. My experiences in both domains urge me to defy that generalization, in fact they are worlds apart.

Don't get me wrong - I love to Spey fish as much as anybody on my homewaters in the pacific northwest... (just ask a lot of the guys I fish with on this BB) but if you ask me the two (surf, stream) are too often construed as the same thing. If anything, I hope the time I spend on this research project leads to a clearer understanding of the differences by the general surf fishing public out here in striper country. Better yet... a new rod design tuned into the realities of surf fishing!

Juro
email: juro@flyfishingforum.com

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