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Topic Review (Newest First)
01-25-2008 05:16 PM
sean Full sinkers are for losers. I classify the fisherman by the lines

In all seriousness I think you can fish any line in any condition. Some lines may just be easier to do it with than others. I will fish a tip before a full sink cause I like the control and knowing exactly what my line is doing.

Mostly a floater though as I fish 95% at night when the big girls tend to mosey about in the upper water column more often than during the day.

-sean
01-25-2008 02:58 PM
juro OK Sean Juan get serious why dont you...

You're half right in my opinion, but opinions are like A**holes... you know the saying.

The bayside fish make pushes into the shallows on the start of the flood but late in the flood the water they are in is well beyond what the wading angler can comfortably (safely) fish, thus it's almost always a boat show not counting the +/- period around the low when all shore anglers fish that side, except for Mike Oliver in 2008 perhaps.

From a boat the line always wants to rise and the fish although sometimes will most often will not when they are grubbing noticeably along the bottom in said depths often 6 feet or more.

Sure they come up top once in a while, but most often you see them buzzing like giant cockroaches on the bottom and the one who stays down hooks up the most.

In these conditions a floater is useless, an intermediate is limited and a sinker is best.

But if you know where the fish terminate their push especially dawn / dusk you don't need a sinking line ever even from a boat, and a floater is probably best, with an unweighted fly (similar to tailing bonefish).

Same flat, same tide different pack behavior.

Clearly for every pack hunting the edge of the peat grass there are dozens cruising the flooded plain in 6 feet of water so boaters are smart to play the numbers with a sinking line.

Although we are conditioned to fish the bottom of the tide, observe the channels especially where they merge near shore and give those spots a try in the evening or morning calm. That's when I have seen the most tailing activity.

In summary, trying to categorize the fishing by a line type is bass-ackwards. It's much wiser to classify the line by the fishing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Juan
Actually I think I see a theme....

How many of the Sinking line crowd fish more on the Bayside or North of Cape Cod

Vs

How many of the non-sinking crowd fish primarily the Southside or South of Cape cod.

I don't know everyone's habits and most people probably fish both but I suspect that the guys who fish the flats that have bigger heavier tides have learned the value of the full sinker where the guys who fish the flats where the tides are smaller have learned to value the non-sinker.

Just a thought
01-25-2008 02:57 PM
Smcdermott One of my favorites (and certainly guilty my first time out to South Beach) is the Rookie No-Cast. That is where you stand there watching a school of a hundred keepers mosey down the flat commenting on the huge numbers of fish in front of you while your guide/partner yells "CAST...CAST...CAST".
01-25-2008 02:30 PM
BigDave Let's not forget the LEAPER CAST which is executed by fallling off the bow of a poled skiff while casting to a passing bonefish. Adrian has witnessed this rare maneuver first hand. Generally followed by the MOSES, DETOUR and QUIET TODAY.
01-25-2008 01:25 PM
luckyt
casts

Juro, I see why you are a guide. You have all the right casts nailed as far as timing. Great read..
01-25-2008 11:23 AM
Sean Juan Actually I think I see a theme....

How many of the Sinking line crowd fish more on the Bayside or North of Cape Cod

Vs

How many of the non-sinking crowd fish primarily the Southside or South of Cape cod.

I don't know everyone's habits and most people probably fish both but I suspect that the guys who fish the flats that have bigger heavier tides have learned the value of the full sinker where the guys who fish the flats where the tides are smaller have learned to value the non-sinker.

Just a thought
01-25-2008 09:30 AM
Adrian Just spit my coffee all over the keyboard .........
01-25-2008 09:21 AM
juro haha

Then there's the DETOUR cast, which means the entire school makes a synchronized turn around the 'clothesline'.

Or the dropback cast where the school does a 180 and runs for it's life. The line does not even have to touch the water for this cast, the flailing arms do the job by themselves.

And who could forget the QUIET TODAY cast where the angler wades into the lane up to the armpits and never sees any fish. So he starts blindcasting on the flats. The fish however, see everything.

The more experienced flats angler will know the STATUE cast and the NO-CAST.

The statue cast is made without any visible movement of the legs, arms, or mouth - swiveling only the eyes and is designed to drop the fly about 6 feet to where the biggest cow you've ever seen has appeared from nowhere while you were picking your nose.

The NO-CAST is made when the fish is too close for a statue cast, so you stand there and enjoy the view as it cruises by, giving you 'the middle fin'.
01-24-2008 10:48 PM
Adrian 'Horses for courses' of course.

The sunk line devotees would do well to heed FredA's advice - i.e. "give 'em plenty of lead". Otherwise you may experience a phenomenon that Big Dave calls
"THE MOSES CAST"
Yes folks, you too can create a "parting of the schools"
01-24-2008 10:39 AM
juro As mentioned earlier, wading and fishing from a boat are two different animals thus the qualification that "while wading"...

Again I have found that there are times when one line is much better than another but other times when it does not matter at all.

It takes a regular schedule of many days over years to determine which those are not the samplings gathered on occasional visits. If I had one and only one line, it would be a clear intermediate. Your results may vary. Luckily we are not by any means restricted to one line design so it's a moot point.

The discussion is good though, and the best line is the one that works best for you!

Is it spring yet?
01-24-2008 10:27 AM
RayStachelek I've been telling them Cape guys for 15 years now to use a full sink line in shallow waters. That's what I have been using in Barnstable or Brewster flats.

Two reasons:

We fish from a boat so the sinking line stays at the bottom forcing the fish to keep his eyes looking forward not up. We disguise our location better since we are at the surface floating.

Secondly, since the Cape flats are mostly sand, the line and fly dragged over helps promote a sand eel explosion my moving particles. Gets them rev'ed up!
01-24-2008 08:55 AM
titleguy Iused to be a die-hard intermediate guy, partially forced by financial constraints, but also by what I perceived to be its "versatility". I have no decided for a variety of reason that the "right" sink tip has broader applications that the intermediate. My solution last year for both my 9 wt and my 10 wt two hander was to go to the rio versa tips. I have heard complaits about the casting of the lines, hinging etc., but I found them to be very effective and cast well. Plus, you get 3 real sinking tips and a clear intermediate and very fast changeover. Last year, I fished a 350 on both the 9 and the two hander almost exclusively with good results.
01-24-2008 08:29 AM
highway61 Juro,

What you say makes alot of sense and was verified by the diverse repsonses to my question. Since I am relatively new to fly fishing I am looking for useful info that will help me improve. Eventually I will have to sort through all this stuff and find what works for me, just as all of you have done. Learning about new techniques, tactics, and gear is part of the beauty and fun of this sport. At last years Marlborough show I went to Alan Caolo's presentation on flat fishing. He recommended using intermediate line. So when I read Murphy's book I wondered what you all do. I guess the lesson is that there is more than one way to skin a cat or should I say there is more than one way to filet a fish.

Steve M.
01-24-2008 07:20 AM
FishHawk I use a sinking line all the time and have no problem hooking fish on the Flats.
I do use the intermediate also. But have had better luck with the sinker.
FishHawk
01-24-2008 01:26 AM
PEC54 Floaters with clear sink tips with long leaders ,or a floater with very long leaders .And the direction of the sun/shadows is always taken into consideration.
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