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Art of Casting Analysis, refinement of the cast

Thread: how to progress from single haul(??) to double haull Reply to Thread
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Topic Review (Newest First)
06-14-2007 12:08 AM
Eric One thing that hasn't been mentioned is the flexing of the lower portion of the rod in this process.

The leverage for the long cast comes from the lower part of the rod (at least for me). You've got to learn how to put this lower third of the stick into play and the easiest way to do that, (again, I think), is to imagine pulling the line from behind. Imagining this will help you push your rod hand forward without bending the wrist, causing the deep "to the corks" flex in the lower, power, part of the rod. Hard stop at about 10 o'clock and a soft, pointing follow-through help get the thing launched. As has been pointed out, it doesn't take much of a pull in terms of number inches of line to get the double-hauled line rocketing out over the water.

I got this cheerful fact from the Mel Krieger book on fly casting and it certainly works for me.

My .02

Eric
06-10-2007 09:54 AM
striblue Juro, good info from you. When I ran the saltwater school at Fishing the Cape I noticed good casters simply forgetting to let the line hand DRIFT back on the end of the back cast.... They would do the second haul somewhere down by their thighs.... That being done with good timing lets you FEEL the rod load much better.... and alows a second haul without the "strip down" by jerking it way more than necessary...... a second haul a foot down or so should give you all you need.... You see some guys jeking it down so hard and long that they are thowing themselves out of their waders... looks great but useless...John
06-10-2007 02:46 AM
bonehead
Where to start...

Ok, first, I'd like to say that Juro is doing a hell of great job instructing here. I like that about the haul paralleling the casting stroke. Good stuff.

Noticed a couple things here though.

1) Starting at 2 o'clock? Nah, all casts should start with zero slack, which means the rod starts at the water's surface. That way you can begin to load the rod from the moment you start moving it. Starting with the rod lifted means you're denying yourself feet of casting room. Remember, the longer the rod moves through the casting stroke, the more it will load. Start low.

2) You don't really want to look like that vid. Trust me. Not that the gentleman is doing a bad job of casting, but he clearly has found what works for him... after much trial and error, if I'm any judge. To begin with his stance is working against him. Being right handed his right foot should be back, not forward. That way he can move his arm as far back as he wants, without having to turn his body like that. Turning the body usually results in sweeping the rod tip in a semi-circle, which equals wasted energy. Also, look at his hand. It starts low and ends high on the backcast and drops back down on the forward cast. That's a sure fire recipe for tailing loops = wind-knots = bad juju. Try to keep your hand on the same plane during the cast, and again, keep it low.

3) Juro's absolutely right. Start learning the haul with inches, not feet. Right at the moment when you make your 'power snap', 'speed stroke' or whatever you want call it, give the line a quick 2-inch tug. Using the wrist will suffice. The line should take off. When it does, let it take those few inches back into the rod. Do that on both the forward and back cast.

Hope this helps.
Bonehead
05-28-2007 08:38 AM
juro You could be trying to learn Beethoven before you can play some Chuck Berry by going to that site as a starting point.

I'm only working with the slightest hint of your personality and thinking process from your post but I assumed you were asking for clarity on the basics of the technique.

You can refine things to the Nth degree once you understand the basics.

Staying with the music analogy, you do best when you experiment with different influences so try out both / all and let us know which work for you.

Getting a personal instructor will allow for the best interaction and results.

regards,
Juro
05-28-2007 01:26 AM
ncflyfisherman Juro, from Sexyloops, it looks like I want to:
1) pull straight down, do a back cast while doing a circle from my stomach to my ear back to my rod, then do a second pull straight down (by pull straight down like a locomotive pulling the cho cho). I have been pulling at about 45 degrees (not my hip, more like my mid stomach). I am getting this from http://www.sexyloops.com/movies/paulcast.shtml


Quote:
Originally Posted by juro
#1 - the answer to your question:

The hand drifts back up toward the rod handle at the end of the backcast, so you can pull again on the forward cast.

Two feet is a lot to start with. Start with inches not feet.

The cast should have been energized enough to 'yank' the line back, pulling the hand back toward the cork, otherwise you need to work on the cast itself.

There can be no slack at the start of the haul in either direction or the haul just pulls up slack and adds no power.

#2 - Tune up:

You mentioned down at the hip.... you'd be better off to pull the line so that your arm ends up angled outward (45 deg or so) to that side instead of downward to the hip.

Now as an experiment, back-haul with 6-8 feet of extra line on the ground between the reel and the line hand.

Let the line go after the stop... does the line shoot backwards and slap tight to the reel, taking all of the slack vigorously with it when you let go?

It really should if you want to get to a double haul. Keep practicing until it does.

Why? The backcast haul should add enough extra energy to the backcast to eliminate all slack and help bring your hand back up toward the cork for the foreward haul.


#3 - The foreward haul:

Now that the hand has been yanked back up to the rod by the super-charged backcast, you are ready to pull the line hand on the forward cast.

Again, if you let go after the stroke does the line vigorously shoot forward, taking all the slack and sometimes slapping tight at the reel? It should both ways.

Summary:

A haul increases the load in the rod beyond what the rod can do by itself by "pulling from the other end".

This extra zip helps the hand easily drift back up toward the cork after the stop, which allows the hand to haul again in the other direction.

For a single back/forth motion there are four parts - pull/drift, and pull/drift.

In musical terms, think One-and-two-and where you pull on the count and drift on the pause.

Start with inches, not feet.


good luck
05-25-2007 07:54 AM
juro #1 - the answer to your question:

The hand drifts back up toward the rod handle at the end of the backcast, so you can pull again on the forward cast.

Two feet is a lot to start with. Start with inches not feet.

The cast should have been energized enough to 'yank' the line back, pulling the hand back toward the cork, otherwise you need to work on the cast itself.

There can be no slack at the start of the haul in either direction or the haul just pulls up slack and adds no power.

#2 - Tune up:

You mentioned down at the hip.... you'd be better off to pull the line so that your arm ends up angled outward (45 deg or so) to that side instead of downward to the hip.

Now as an experiment, back-haul with 6-8 feet of extra line on the ground between the reel and the line hand.

Let the line go after the stop... does the line shoot backwards and slap tight to the reel, taking all of the slack vigorously with it when you let go?

It really should if you want to get to a double haul. Keep practicing until it does.

Why? The backcast haul should add enough extra energy to the backcast to eliminate all slack and help bring your hand back up toward the cork for the foreward haul.


#3 - The foreward haul:

Now that the hand has been yanked back up to the rod by the super-charged backcast, you are ready to pull the line hand on the forward cast.

Again, if you let go after the stroke does the line vigorously shoot forward, taking all the slack and sometimes slapping tight at the reel? It should both ways.

Summary:

A haul increases the load in the rod beyond what the rod can do by itself by "pulling from the other end".

This extra zip helps the hand easily drift back up toward the cork after the stop, which allows the hand to haul again in the other direction.

For a single back/forth motion there are four parts - pull/drift, and pull/drift.

In musical terms, think One-and-two-and where you pull on the count and drift on the pause.

Start with inches, not feet.


good luck
05-25-2007 03:32 AM
ncflyfisherman
how to progress from single haul(??) to double haull

Ok, I start at 2 ok with both hands together, left hand holding line. My right hand progrosses back to 12, my left hand strippes about 2feet of line so it is at about my hip. Now how do I get this extra line back into reel so I can do another haul for the forward cast?

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