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Propwash A boat is a hole in the water into which you pour... good times!

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Topic Review (Newest First)
03-08-2007 05:00 PM
tight-lines sounds like a good place for a drift boat too ! :-)
03-08-2007 01:51 AM
flytyer Joe,

Callicoon is well upstream of Easton. In fact, it is well upstream of the Water Gap. The town of Hancock, NY is about 15-20 miles or so upstream of Callicoon. In other words, I fished for shad in the very top end of the river just below the confluence of the East and West Branches. A 2-hander with sinking tips would be ideal for shad in the upper Delaware, and you could fish for trout when you got tired of hooking shad without having to go elsewhere.

Yep, shad are a load of fun and not all that easy to land because of their soft mouths, which tear fairly easily.
03-07-2007 06:04 PM
tight-lines Thanks for your input MRobertson.
maintenance was an issue I have been pineing over.

I'm actually starting to consider a stich and glue boat over a framed boat one because I believe I can make it lighter and two because I think it will take a little less maintenance. I don't think it will be as much fun to build, but I hope it will hold up better. Maybe I can set up a place on the forum were I can show pictures of my progress. Although the wife said I have to build a shed first. lol

Russ,
You are probably right about stocking shad fry to get good returns and I'm sure it is something that should be done systematically over many years for good results.To be honest Shad doesn't seem to be a prority for the Fish commision any more.
For some reason a lot of the gas has run out of the shad fishing scene here. We used to have a shad festival, and the shad contest would draw many many anglers but I think the festival is no more and the contest isn't well attended. I remember we used to even have a shad hot line you could call to see if the shad had made if past the wing dam down near New Hope. Their was I guy down their that had the last comercial license to net in the Delaware. He would supply all the local resturants with roe which was always on the menu from late April through may.
To be honest I 'm not sure what has happened I know I stopped fishing for them once I found the long rod. Most of our water is to deep to fish with a floating line and the season runs parralell to some of our streams local hatches.

I'm not sure were Callicoon is in relation to Easton but I'll look it up on the map. I fished mostly from Easton north. Me and Dad would put the canoe in the morning pack a lunch and make a trip out of it. Usually did more paddleing than fishing but dad loved to canoe still does at 79! Yeah, it was a lot of fun those shad were called poor man' s tarpon for a reason. I'm going to look into what is going on with the fisherie a little more and get back to you.
03-07-2007 01:50 PM
flytyer Joe,

In my opinion, it is going to take a lot more than ladders at the two dams at Easton to get the shad back in the Lehigh. I think that it is going to take a fair number of shad fry being put in the river, preferably at the mouth of (or possibly in) each of the currently clean, larger feeder streams (Mud Run and Hickory Run come readily to mind and I know there are others because I used to access the canyon above Jim Thorpe via them) as well as the river just below the dam, at White Have, Lehigh Tannery, Jim Thorpe, Lehighton, Palmerton, and Bowmanstown. I think a rather large number of shad fry in all these spots is needed to begin the re-eatablishing the run because hatchery raised anadromous fish have return rates of around 5% and of those returning, very few will probably successfully spawn and produce another generation in the wild.

I have many fond memories of shad fishing in the Delaware in the area around Callicoon.
03-07-2007 07:44 AM
MRobertson Tight-Lines,
Just saw this thread and thought I'd throw in my .02 cents. I built a Tatman about 12 years ago. I thoroughly enjoyed the process and, as Eric mentioned, felt a lot of satisfaction fishing and rowing that boat. I built the 16 footer which is really a 2 man boat. It will fish 2 anglers and an oarsman, but it didn't handle well with the second angler in the back. I would definately go with the 17 footer if you plan to have three people in the boat.

Maintenance and storage are two factors to consider carefully. You will have maintenance and you need to have a covered space to store a woodie. After 10 years, I sold my boat to some friends because I didn't want to go through another painting/varnishing session. I now own a Boulder Boatworks boat and have virtually no maintenance issues with the hull.

Wooden boats are the prettiest boats on the water. Since you are a carpenter, the maintenance issues probably won't bother you a bit. Love to see apicture of how it turns out.
03-06-2007 07:56 PM
tight-lines Russ,
I've heard stories about the way it used to be before the Damn Dam :-)
They are trying to get it figured out with the flows and temps. I think the rafting industry is losing some of it's muscle and fishing interests are starting to be heard. To be honest maintanable flows and temps should benefit all. They are also setting up lime beds to try to get a handle on the mine drainage on some of the feeder streams.

Shad: two ladders were built about ten years ago both at the dams in easton. To my knowledge after much fan fair the runs have been very poor the only thing I've seen through the viewing windows have been lamprey eels. To be honest it's my understanding the shad runs on the Delaware as a whole have been way down. It's been quite a while since I spent a sunny april day fishing for shad but I hear the runs have been dwindleing. Some say they are netting them off shore for fertalizer others that the Stripped bass which are much more prevelent in the river are eating them up. I don't think it's a polution problem the rivers are probably as clean as they have been in quite a long while. My dad tells me stories of how he used to go swimming in the Lehigh in the 30's and come home with an oil slick around him. Although both rivers do suffer from run off from develpoment and sewage instead of industrial polution. On a whole considering how populated both these drainage systems are it's amazing they do so well.
03-06-2007 07:05 PM
flytyer Joe,

Glad to hear you got the 2-hander finished and that was able to be of some help to you with it.

Personally, I would have been much happier if the damn dam had never been built on the Lehigh because I remember how good the Lehigh was before the dam. I remember well the white water rafters arguing and getting their way for having the flows get ramped way up several times in summer back in the early 70's so they could do their thing in the Class IV rapids that result when flows are up in the willows, which they like.

It is good that the dam was raised so that cold water (instead of the tepid stuff that was released before it was raised) is released. This helps keep it the cold water trout river it was before the dam was built.

I have been told by my father and one of my brothers that PA is considering re-introducing shad to the Lehigh. I'd like to see that happen because there once was a very good shad run in it prior to the acid mine, zinc mining, and zinc smelting polution killed everything in the river below Jim Thorpe. Now that the polution has been cleaned up (and the zinc operations have closed up) the river has come back nicely and I think it is time to put the species back into it that were there before the polution killed them.
03-06-2007 05:09 PM
tight-lines
Quote:
Originally Posted by flytyer
Joe,

I grew up 15 miles from Hazleton and fished the Upper Delaware, West Branch, and Lehigh in the gorge a lot before I left PA at age 25 back in 1978. A drift boat would be a great fishing craft on either the Delaware or the Lehigh. Although I spent a lot of time walking the old RR grade on the west side of the Lehigh between Lehigh Tannery and Jim Thorpe, it would have been a whole lot nicer to have a drift boat to access this area.

You will find the drift boat to be very nice to take through the many rapids (yes, even the class III's found in this stretch). Likewise, a drift boat on the Upper Delaware mainstem, west branch, or east branch would have made a lot more water available.
Hey Russ,
Good to hear from you again BTW I finished that spey rod I was working on this fall thanks for your advice. I didn't have much luck catching with it but had fun trying. Will give it a go again next season.
Yes I thought a D boat would be great in the upper Lehigh and Upper Delaware. I'm not much more than 40 minutes from Jim Thorpe. I think I mentioned the last time we spoke they are trying to make the Lehigh a year around trout fishery from the Damn down to Bowmanstown. They are haveing their difficulties, mid gates failed this spring, rafters worring about losing buisness,but they have raised the water levels allowed in the lake once and are trying to get another increase. It's a tough battle especially since water runoff is such a heated topic here in the northeast but, three hundred year floods in two years will do that to people.

Back to the boat, I think It would work out great and should be a fun project.

Joe
03-06-2007 12:52 PM
titleguy I have two friends in Vt who built their own driftboats- they do the Delaware every May for a week. They also use them on the Upper Connecticut and two years ago on the East Outlet, the headwaters of the Kennebec River in Maine. There are quiet a few drift boats operating up here in Maine on the Kennebec, Androscoggin and Penobscot Rivers.
03-05-2007 10:49 PM
flytyer Joe,

I grew up 15 miles from Hazleton and fished the Upper Delaware, West Branch, and Lehigh in the gorge a lot before I left PA at age 25 back in 1978. A drift boat would be a great fishing craft on either the Delaware or the Lehigh. Although I spent a lot of time walking the old RR grade on the west side of the Lehigh between Lehigh Tannery and Jim Thorpe, it would have been a whole lot nicer to have a drift boat to access this area.

You will find the drift boat to be very nice to take through the many rapids (yes, even the class III's found in this stretch). Likewise, a drift boat on the Upper Delaware mainstem, west branch, or east branch would have made a lot more water available.
03-05-2007 07:42 PM
tight-lines Good tip about the book Eric I will find a copy somewhere. I understand your points about loading the boat for running white water as opposed to drifting and fishing. I have done many white water canoe trips to northern Canada many of which well over 100 miles. Part of the allure of a drift boat is that it will allow me to run water I wouldn't be comfortable running in a loaded canoe. Nothing like getting soaked, loseing your gear, or worse at the start of a ten day trip! Also rowing is a completely different dynamic than paddeling a canoe I love the sense of "setting up" a shot a drift boat gives you. I've also considered going the way of a raft or cat but there is just something about building a boat that intregues me even if I don't use it to it's full potential.
Thanks for all the insight
Joe
03-04-2007 08:43 PM
Eric Great Thread: Wish I'd Thought to Start It

JD makes some excellent points above.

Being a Bibliophile of Addiction, I would recommend you secure a copy of Dan Alsop's book, _Driftboats_ (Amato Publications, ISBN 1-57188-189-1) to get some real background on these remarkable, unique and wonderful craft.

Re Anglers in the Stern: Bear in mind that drift boats are white water craft. They were not designed with float fishing in mind, but rather maximum manueverability in heavy white water. When the boat tilts, as it does in heavy water, the chines on either side act as rudders to stabilize the boat. JD refers to rocker: the bow and stern should be a bit out of the water, but, in a heavily laden boat, this isn't always possible. I would never want to be in a boat that was laden below the rock boards if any heavy white water was to be encountered.

Bottom line, though, is to pull the weight. Make sure your load is in front of you. If you anticipate running class 2 or better rapids, make sure your stern angler sits up front. In flat water, doesn't really matter much.

When running, you'll want your passengers to distribute themselves so that the boat is centered. I have a gauge mounted on my brace board so that my passengers can see when Nimue is riding level.

Again, these are white water craft. There's a real high mixed with gripping fear that comes when you enter the tongue of a difficult rapid. Ahead you see only tumbling white water -- in your head you must see the boulders in your careening path and follow the plan you laid when you scouted the rapid from below. Pull, pivot, Pull, Pull, Pull, Pivot, Pull, Pull, Pull, whew! It's exhilarating!

Not that these aren't fishing boats. They are as stable a craft as a johnboat and can accomodate two fly fishermen very well (maybe only one Spey caster at a time). They are versitile boats and can be launched anywhere you can drag them or throw them (most of us Steelheaders carry 100 foot ropes for impromptu launchs).

But, as I said, they are built to get you safely through the rapids.

Get or borrow the book if you don't already have it.

Cheers,

Eric
03-04-2007 07:08 PM
tight-lines Thanks JD
Their are a few drift boats in the east but not many, and I have yet to see a homemade one. To be honest that is a lot of my problem not much handy to compare too. I've done a lot of canoe tripping so at least I have some basic idea of what boat design entails. How much rocker would you suggest the boat have at a minimum? As I understand it if you want to fish with an angler in the back it is important that the stern be kept out of the water so as not to act like a rudder. Was your freind generally happy with his Tatman boat aside from the skidplate?
03-04-2007 04:10 PM
JDJones
DB Kits

I have a friend who built a Greg Tatman boat. Nice looking boat. He put a 3/4 thk uhmw skid plate on the bottom which added quite a bit of weight. And he has had maintainence problems with the skid plate.

Somewhere on the web, I once found either uhmw or kevlar sheet in thicknesses of .060 to .090 to be glued on the bottom of drift boats. That makes more sense to me.

Things to check out when considering DB kits are specified length. Some are measured straight down the center line ,as you would suspect. Others are measured around the side. Like a 17 ft boat takes a 17 ft long piece of plywood to build it. But, in reality,, it may only be 15 ft down the c/l. The other thing that is important is the amount of rocker and the amount of freeboard. Being a rather specialized design in itself, there are no hard, fast rules for drift boats. And everyone will tell you theirs is the best for one reason or another.

You will probably have the only drift boat on the east coast. Enjoy.
03-03-2007 11:15 PM
Eric A 17' foot boat is your best bet, I think. Big enough to carry gear, but not too big for smaller waters or short trips. I don't take my wooden boat steelheading on the Alsea.

The bottom of my boat is double-sheathed marine plywood coated with carbon-fiber impregnated epoxy over fiberglass. Very tough and very slick (but very heavy).

Yearly maintenance is simple: interior is oil finish. I recoat that as soon as it gets warm enough each spring. The clear wood on the shear rails and gunnels is coated with spar varnish. This again is a once-a-year touch up. The remainder of the exterior is painted with a marine paint. I've only painted this once and never repainted.

Incidentally, the whole boat is glassed.

Get good oars! Get four good oars!

Cheers,

Eric
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