: I use water quality as a guide
11-16-2002, 09:54 PM
Without knowing much about your water, I understand that it has alot to do with your water quality and akaline. The lower the O2 content the smaller and more to the red spectrum. The greater the O2 content the larger and more to the green spectrum. We tie a fly called a RedAss that has red thread with peacock hurl. It is a good attractor that seems to work well in our varying water quality. I would imagine if you are on still waters you would want to stay in the red spectrum somewhat.
Just my guess.
11-17-2002, 01:24 PM
Are you inferring we should all use red flies ? :confused:
11-17-2002, 03:10 PM
I'll figure out how to post here one of these days. That was supposed to be in another thread but I hit the new post button. He was asking what color soft hackels to use when he couldn't figure out what they were taking.
But to answer your question Hal as long as you are fishing still waters I'd just about say that is a universal yes. Especially if you are fishing chromonids of some sort. Generally I have found that red patterns or variants of that color work quite well in still water. One of the best still water brown trout flies is a black wooly bugger with red flash. The red or claret buzzer is a popular fly in the UK. As you increase in depth you lose most of the color spectrum anyway.
Just my opinion......
11-17-2002, 08:40 PM
Yes thats what I thought you did, hit the wrong button. I have seen those UK buzzers, a black wooly worm with red flash, ehhh
Have to get some red flash, have every other color but that, figures doesn't it, another trip to the old fly shop.
Would you consider Lake Michigan still water ?
11-17-2002, 09:24 PM
I would generally define anything that has a muddy bottom as still water. I guess the defining factor would really be O2 content. But if you are on the downwind side of the lake on a windy day the oxygen content may be higher which would change the type of hatches you'd see. I believe that "in general" fish that are in low O2 environments key on red where fish in high O2 environments key on green.
Since we fish tailwaters the O2 content changes dramatically the farther you get from the dams. Once you pass about 10 miles the water has been disturbed so much that any and all hydrogen sulfide has been released and the bugs change considerably. In the winter our bugs are small anyway. Our caddis go from a size 10 in the summer to a size 22 in the fall. But they are also drastically effected by O2 levels as well.
Hal I have absolutely no scientific proof to back this up. These are just my observations over the years.
11-18-2002, 04:52 PM
Thanks sounds good to me, now how do I apply this strategy ?
How do I get one of those 02 measuring devices ?
11-18-2002, 08:24 PM
The stream and/or lake will have some pretty dead give aways to the oxygen content. The first is green plant content. If it has lots of green it is generally high in O2 as well. The less obvious might be a robust bubble line. It seams that when our waters get low on O2 that they tend to hold bubbles longer. Thus making the water "foamy". The differences can be small though. Understand that you are talking about the difference between maybe 4ppm and 8ppm. The differences in the color are what I use for a waters "general" quality and depth. I have no real idea why it works, but it seems to work well.
11-21-2002, 09:45 AM
Very interesting theory. It might explain why I have great luck with specific patterns in specific colors on some rivers and don't touch a fish with the same pattern on other waters right? So have you put this theory to the test using streamers? Like the big ones..... for big browns?
11-21-2002, 10:01 PM
Actually I am a competition fly fisher, and one of my favorite way for "searching" a still water that I am unfamiliar with is to use a black streamer with red flashaboo in it. I have 3 "attractor" patterns that I use in practice sessions. When I am on still waters that have browns in them those attractors will always include, red, and gold. Maybe its the oxygen content because I rarely use red in rivers.
11-21-2002, 10:43 PM
Gold is one of my favorite colors for tinsel ribbing of a fly.
This theory needs further exploration. Have to get some red flash tinsel, etc, , been meaning to but never seen it used much out here.
P.S. Lipripper (John) don't give him to much information on where we fish, he is a REAL good brown fisherman, which our waters will not be able to sustain pressure from. :D
11-22-2002, 06:24 AM
With some of the pictures I've seen lately from your area....I am certianly missing out on "something". Pay no attention to PMflyfisher though. You can tell me everything. ;)
11-22-2002, 11:33 AM
You guys crack me up.
Gold/Yellow=Brown Trout Crack
Maybe we should do a streamer swap Hal.
I will say this John....I share the opinion with a few other MI guys that the new World Record Brown is gonna come from a trib about 2.5 hours from my front door.:razz:
11-22-2002, 11:48 AM
I am sure there are several places around the world that have fish in excess of 40 lbs right now. The northern states get some fantastic browns every year. I'd love to have a shot at some of those lakers next fall. It would be nice to be able to take some fish with heavier tackle for a change.
Hop a plane and I'll show you a pool with 10 fish in it over 40 lbs. I hooked one of them last month that was at least 50 maybe more (some of you might have noticed I wasn't posting for a while here). I guided a "beginner" fly fisher 2 weeks ago that hooked (and lost) a male that was in excess of 35 and was not the biggest fish in the run by far. The fish are in the river no doubt we just have a heck of a time landing them with light tackle due to all the rough cover. They almost have to beach themselves or be at the point of death when you hook one.
You ought to see the action when the stocker truck makes a delivery. It's almost frightening to see those massive fish eating 14" stockers like a killer whale eating seals. Little silver trout bodies flying through the air as a 60" toothy brown tail slaps them into submission. :whoa:
11-22-2002, 11:55 AM
Yes I knew you were trophy brown hunting when your postings stopped. Hey maybe we should be working on our 14 inch brown and rainbow hatchery fish streamer flies ? Then follow the trucks and let them fly with our heavy spey rods. A strategy to think about further over the winter.
I am convinced if you want a big brown use a big fly at night.
11-22-2002, 12:08 PM
John, don't they have a weekly stocking program during some months of the year down there? Heck, I'd hop a plane just to see that feeding frenzy you described.:whoa:
Hal, I have one called the Easter Bunny. It's about eight inches long. All white and gray Maribou with rainbow flash and a flat wool head and 2 big ole doll eyes. I tied it up last year after my buddy caught a brown on a streamer and it puked up a half digested planter. You can't imagine what it is like to cast. My buddys all laugh at me, but they won't be laughing when it plucks a lunker beast-meister browny!:hehe:
11-22-2002, 12:16 PM
I feel deficient as a big brown fisherman, my biggest streamer is only 4-5 inches long probably , going to have to go bigger I can see. :chuckle:
How about a big brown streamer swap ?
11-22-2002, 12:45 PM
I have a couple of patterns I'd be interested in sharing ;)
FlyFishAR - most of those lunkers you're talking about are not lake run, correct? Unbeleivable...would love to see a picture.
I'd imagine there's a pretty big difference in both diet and behavior between these fish and the GL trib Seeforellens that are primarily in to spawn. I have seen a 10 pound brown choke down a 14" stockie at my feet - which scared the hell out of me at the time - but can't imagine the scene when one of those BIG BOYS is on the warpath.
11-22-2002, 05:12 PM
24 years ago, on our way back from big brown fishing in the NYS Pepacton reservoir in the Catskills we stopped by the Delaware river. It was summer time. We were exhausted from fishing all night for big browns, but had some sawbellie shiners left in our coolers.
There was an inlet tributary to the Big D in which a number of large browns were laying. We were too tired to fish for them but we decided to throw a few of the dying saw bellies into the pool thinking they would ignore them.
As soon as they hit the water from the bridge we threw them from, they went wild attacking them. Of course had we rigged our rods and thrown them they probably would have ignored them.
Another time on the delaware while fly fishing trout I met an old bait fisherman who was using a big sewn live shiner. I asked him if he ever caught on anything on that and he just smiled and laughed. He said son if you want to catch a big brown this is what you must use and then told me of some of his trophies. The streamer I was using looked much to small for the big ones to even bother with.
Hey I should save these for my fly fishing essays :razz: