Autumn Steelhead or Salmon Fly Swaps [Archive] - Fly Fishing Forum

: Autumn Steelhead or Salmon Fly Swaps


pmflyfisher
08-21-2002, 11:23 PM
What happened to our fly swaps ?

Everyone must be fishing.on vacation, or getting their kids ready for school I guess.

I would be interested in participating, don't know if I have the time to be the fly meister (coordinator) though due to the hellish work schedule that is before me. Plus it is football season and will be following my sons HS team weekly games.

Any body interested ?

Hal

juro
08-22-2002, 08:40 PM
I'd be interested but swaps are typically most popular during off seasons - mid-winter for instance. Frankly with my work schedule, family demands, etc - everything I tie this time of year goes onto a tippet!

Steelheader69
08-26-2002, 12:50 AM
Want me to meister one? Only ONE condition. We set a timeline and it's FOLLOWED!!!!! No more of this (yes, I'm talking about YOU SPARKEY :D ) "give me one more week". I'm game to meister if you'll all abide by timeline.

pmflyfisher
08-26-2002, 02:14 PM
Yes I know what you mean Juro, our best fishing time of the year is almost upon us.

Steelheader69 there will always be some people that cannot make deadlines, happens to me at work all the time, even with senior executives, can you beleive that ? Yes I guess we can after Enron, World Com, Andersen etc..

I would be willing to participate though

Steelheader69
08-28-2002, 12:51 AM
What?!?!?!?! Nahhhhhhhhhhhh. lol If I miss a deadline, it's my butt in a sling at UPS (probably because it's a money back refund if we're late). So I am pretty anal about getting things done on time (and from what I know of you Hal, you're pretty quick about getting things done as well, so don't play coy with me MISTER) :hehe:

If there's enough interest, I'm game to host. I'm in process of tying up what's left of an international fly swap I just hosted (it's weird that I'm ONLY US fly swappee, rest are UK/Europe). Should be interesting.

juro
08-28-2002, 01:11 AM
I agree, some of the recent swaps (not just steelhead) got so beyond the deadline that it was unfair to participants.

We should adopt a gentleman's agreement that swap participants hold to an agreed upon date barring unforseen circumstances, etc. If anyone feels they can't make the date they should wait for the next one so as to respect the other participants who make the effort to meet the given date.

And don't forget the extra fly for the swapmeister!

pmflyfisher
08-28-2002, 10:30 AM
Steelheader69

Ok, I am in what is it an autumn steelhead or salmon swap ?

Just make it ten participants max and with a due date that wil allow us to actually apply the flies to our home waters this year (2002).

Thanks,

Hal

P.S. Jerry your right I am usually always on time it is many of the people I work with who cannot deliver that I must deal with. Delivering on time was learned at 18 years old in a USAF fighter interceptor squadron (Iceland). See link below. When the colonel was always asking why all of his fighters were not flying from the control center upstairs, it was easy for him to come down into the hangar and inquire to his 2 avionics technicians what the heck is taking you so long, etc... The russians are testing our NORAD air defenses (100 times the year I was there)and you guys better get your act together. One gains a fast understanding of what delivering on time means, no matter what the weather or duration of time you needed to work through to meet the objective. Oh yes there was no such thing as sick days either !

http://www.keflavik.af.mil/85gp/index.htm

Steelheader69
08-29-2002, 12:25 AM
How about a salmon swap? They're starting to come into rivers now. Make it your favorite salmon bug for whatever salmon you prefer. May tie up a chum fly I use. Sound good to everyone? 10 max sounds good too. What do you think? Say, flies by first of October? I know it only gives a good month, but seriously speaking. It only takes a good hour or so on the bench to get 10 flies out (unless they're really intricate) and a week max to get to me.

Now, where's the participants??? Maybe Juro can swing this post on the Pacific Salmon board as well.

pmflyfisher
08-29-2002, 10:59 AM
I'm in and ready to divulge a GL king salmon producer from my super private fly wallett.

I have a number of big boys chase this baby down and then bring me down stream with them on their way back to Lake M.

pmflyfisher
09-01-2002, 03:08 PM
Jerry,

Looks like it is just me and you to date. For the record, I have started tying mine.

Hal

Steelheader69
09-02-2002, 09:56 PM
I tied up a few dozen this weekend. I'm trading 2 dozen spey flies for a reel I've been dying to get. At this rate, the 2 extra flies I tied will be fore the fly swap. :D

pmflyfisher
09-03-2002, 10:24 AM
If its just me and you then lets each just tie one each of our favorite salmon flies for a total of ten ?

ashley
09-03-2002, 05:05 PM
Seeing as though I'm packing flies for Jerrys other swap I'll join this one as well and add some GPs.My favorite fly for this time of year.

pmflyfisher
09-03-2002, 05:14 PM
Ashley,

Great we always like those international fly specimens to gain new knowledge from.

That makes 3 participants Jerry.

Hal

Steelheader69
09-10-2002, 01:22 AM
Looks like only three. How are we ever gonna work this one out? Interesting.

ashley
09-11-2002, 05:25 PM
What if we each tie say 2 sets of our favorite flies so we each get 2 flies from each person.

pmflyfisher
09-11-2002, 05:36 PM
Sounds good to me, hey make it 3 of each.

Thats six flies per person to tie.

Hal

nbrandon
09-11-2002, 05:42 PM
can I still get in on this? I might as well be tyin,
since the fish aren't happening.

Neil

juro
09-11-2002, 05:46 PM
When's the deadline again? I do need to pack the Wheatley for a fall trip, could spare a few and LOVE getting the creations others send in! Depends on the deadline for me...

Steelheader69
09-11-2002, 08:10 PM
Doesn't matter, if you want in, let me know. Been tying like crazy lately. So if you want in it's a go. Just let me know when it's feasible for you. Don't want to hold things too long. So what's a good date for everyone. I want to LOCK date in then STICK to it.

Ideas?

pmflyfisher
09-12-2002, 08:54 AM
Cool, I we get to see more of Juro's secret steelhead flies, one has already paid dividends for me, "Purple Nasty". Couple of large skamanias liked it this spring. Now has a permanent position in the fly wallett.

Let me know how many and the due date need to get my mind off 9/11, therapy such as fall steelhead flies and fishing, and sons HS football should do the trick.

Hal

aknightinak
09-14-2002, 12:25 AM
Anyone locked a date yet? What's 2002 season for most of you?

I'd be interested in this as I just got a tying wind by perfecting the egg-leech for cohos. Errr...it's not all C & R folks here is it? Well, you could specify hooks (I tie on Owners to fill our freezer and saltwater Mustads or similar of a more reasonable size for fun).

How fancy or involved do you expect what you get in the mail to be? Not saying I'd cheeze you out of worth, but I do a lot of simple ties that work. They look nice, but they're no Jock Scotts or anything.

Hi by the way. This is my first post. I'll get down to the intros before long.

So sing out with a deadline and I can confirm if everyone'll get a dozen (is that math right).

pmflyfisher
09-14-2002, 02:43 PM
Jerry,

That makes 4 by my count.

aknightinak

How about one of your secret akaska salmon flies, like a streamer I could use for great lakes king salmon. Egg sucking leeches are OK, but we are always looking for those custom FF secret flies, etc..


BTW, welcome to the board. Every one is not C+R here, actually this year I cannot even succeed on the catch, unless you considerthe releases all of the steelhead I have lost this year.

Oh well sometimes a steelheader goes into a slump with no touches or no catches etc.. I have had the touches and battles but no catches in 2002.

Like baseball and other things in life, when in a slump need to keep "trying" and "never ever give up".

PM

aknightinak
09-15-2002, 04:26 AM
Egg sucking leeches are OK, but we are always looking for those custom FF secret flies, etc..

You bet...I was going to drum up something other anyhow; I just got my finger callouses going again by reinventing that old thing.

ashley
09-15-2002, 05:26 AM
Do we have a final count of flies?I'd like to get my flies sent in the next couple of days cause I'm going fishing for a few days after Thursday.I don't want to keep you guys waiting.

pmflyfisher
09-15-2002, 12:42 PM
Ashley,

I'm sure Jerry (Steelheader 69) will be signing in latter today to finalize the count and due dates etc... Looks like there are six of us: Ashley, Pmflyfisher (Hal), Steelheader69 (Jerry), Juro, Nbrandon, and Aknightak.

Look forward to the GP, if that is what you are still tying.

Do you FF for atlantic salmon or steelhead ? The other tyers in this are pacific and great lakes salmon and steelhead anglers. Many of those flies can also be used for atlantic salmon.

Want to tie something every one can fish.

Hal

ashley
09-15-2002, 04:17 PM
Hal,
yes I'm still tying the GP's,the simple version but very effective.I FF for atlantic salmon when we have the water and they're running which we don't and they're not.The autumn run should start when the rains start which should be when I get back.
I've read in several places that the GP works well for steelhead.
Ashley

pmflyfisher
09-15-2002, 04:28 PM
Ashley,

Yes it works in our Pacific Northwest Steelhead (PNW) rivers but is not used much in great lakes rivers, but I suppose it would work if one fished it for along enough period confidently, in the color black. As one steelhead expert said "Any color is good as long as it is black". Probably have to agree, if I was limited to one color it would probably be black.

Our rivers are also low here due to the very hot and dry summer we have had. It is cooling off now though into the 60s, some fall rains and the steelhead and paciific salmon runs will really take off all over the great lakes.

Look forward to the GPs ! :D

Cheers,

Hal

juro
09-15-2002, 05:02 PM
We should get one more person, then send in six flies and we all get one of each. How about mid-October for a deadline?

Steelheader69
09-16-2002, 02:49 AM
Mid October would work fine. If we can find one more that would be great. Guess we'll wait and see. I'm game for whatever time you guys want to get this thing ended.

pmflyfisher
09-16-2002, 08:15 PM
That works for me.

nbrandon
09-17-2002, 08:59 AM
sure, mid october sounds good to me

aknightinak
09-17-2002, 10:35 AM
5 - possibly 6 flies? Mid-october's good.

ashley
09-17-2002, 05:04 PM
Mid October is good for me.Give me chance to look and copy the flies over the winter.My season ends October 14th so I won't be able to lose them.:)

Steelheader69
09-20-2002, 11:31 AM
I have 6 fly swappers. Myself, Juro, Pmflyfisher, Ashley, Nbrandon, and AKnightinak.

So, once you get them all tied up, send them to
Jerry Daschofsky
5085 NE 37th St
Tacoma, WA 98422
USA

Look forward to getting all the flies. Fishing is hot right now, so I'm trying to do as much tying inbetween fishing and Dr's appts (I'm off on disibility right now).

juro
09-20-2002, 01:44 PM
6 flies - 5 of which get returned to each swapper (one from each participant but himself), the extra one goes to the meister; a Forum tradition.

Also, you should include postal fare and of course return address information. For international parcels, marking them as gift relieves tariffs in some cases.

We have decided that it is taboo to miss deadlines in fly swaps conducted in the forum.

aknightinak
09-21-2002, 05:48 AM
do you have hook restrictions - legal or moral - where you fish? 'no' gets 'em on a 2/0 octopus or similar (my preference after 6 years experimentation up here); 'yes' get's em on a more traditional, reasonable hook like a straight streamer or salmon hook under an /0 size.

Steelheader69
09-21-2002, 12:34 PM
No restrictions. Tie what you use. I'm like you, I fish a variety, in fact, I'm more conventional then flie. I just love to fly fish too though, and REALLY love to tie. I tie up quite a few flies on Octopus hooks, or use octopus stingers. So, don't feel ashamed, tie what you normally tie. May give others a good idea on a pattern.

pmflyfisher
09-30-2002, 05:16 PM
Mine are almost done, will be sending them out in advance of the due date.

juro
09-30-2002, 06:33 PM
Originally posted by aknightinak
do you have hook restrictions - legal or moral - where you fish? 'no' gets 'em on a 2/0 octopus or similar (my preference after 6 years experimentation up here); 'yes' get's em on a more traditional, reasonable hook like a straight streamer or salmon hook under an /0 size.

Originally posted by Steelheader69
No restrictions. Tie what you use. I'm like you, I fish a variety, in fact, I'm more conventional then flie. I just love to fly fish too though, and REALLY love to tie. I tie up quite a few flies on Octopus hooks, or use octopus stingers. So, don't feel ashamed, tie what you normally tie. May give others a good idea on a pattern.

So... I won't be sending anything from the Syd Glasso collection afterall :devil:

pmflyfisher
09-30-2002, 07:46 PM
A Syd Glasso spey would be very welcome, of course I would never fish it.

Steelheader69
10-01-2002, 12:36 AM
I actually went out and tied up a bunch of my purple peril speys too Juro. I guess I'll throw them in my fly box and go tie up some standard hairwings. LOL

Mine aren't as fancy as Syd's, but I do a decent job. LOL.

But seriously, that's what I tied up.

ashley
10-03-2002, 06:54 PM
I'm putting my flies in the post tomorrow.
I think Hal was hinting he wants a black one,he might get one.;)
Ashley

pmflyfisher
10-05-2002, 11:38 AM
Jerry,

Mine are going to into the post now. Maybe this will be the "black" perhaps dark color salmon and steelhead swap. Will send the name and tying specs by PM, and if I get the digital camera this week, (search is on) will post up the picture and instructions myself. Tough right now with steelhead and salmon season, along with my sons football season is full swing. God I love this time of year.

Best

Hal

Crusty
10-07-2002, 01:35 PM
Next time there is a swap, will someone please wake me up?

Crusty :D

pmflyfisher
10-13-2002, 10:24 PM
Here are the tying instructions:

Hook: Upeye salmon of your choice. Size 2-4 for salmon 6 -10 for steelhead

Tail: Black bear or substitute black squirrel
Butt: Fluorescent chartreuse cactus chenille- Fine
Body: Black cactus chenille - large
Wing: Black bear or black squirrel
Thread: Red

I trim the black cactus down to different silhouette shapes with a Zissor (sp?). An alternate pattern is to use a hot cerise butt with cactus chenille.

Weight or unweight the body as you please.

Fly imitates a stone fly, IMO, but provides a dark silhouette with some color and flash from the cactus chenille. Good for those deep dark pools and runs.

juro
10-14-2002, 12:19 PM
Repreive request -

I would like to ask for a free pass until I return from my next steelhead outing before I send in my flies. I simply do not have the spare time to tie enough for the trip and the swap until I return. To give you an idea, I have ZERO tied to date.

Let's set the mail out deadline for October 28th - if there are no objections. If that's too late I would have to bow out and let Crusty take my place.

thanks,

Juro

pmflyfisher
10-14-2002, 01:44 PM
I will be satisfied if you send me one of your Purple Nastys so I can further adapt my version. :D

NrthFrk16
10-15-2002, 12:32 AM
Originally posted by juro
I would like to ask for a free pass until I return from my next steelhead outing before I send in my flies. I simply do not have the spare time to tie enough for the trip and the swap until I return.

You headed this way?

aknightinak
10-17-2002, 02:07 AM
Originally posted by juro
Repreive request -

I would like to ask for a free pass until I return from my next steelhead outing before I send in my flies. I simply do not have the spare time to tie enough for the trip and the swap until I return. To give you an idea, I have ZERO tied to date.

Let's set the mail out deadline for October 28th - if there are no objections. If that's too late I would have to bow out and let Crusty take my place.

thanks,

Juro
http://board.strikenet.at/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/withstupid.gif

okay mr. We have decided that it is taboo to miss deadlines in fly swaps conducted in the forum.
http://board.strikenet.at/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/arsch.gif

good.
i'll maybe not haul azimuth to the post office tomorrow but wait til friday when I'm up there anyhow. i was sure i was holding things up by now.
thanks.

they're kinda basic, but no less love went into 'em.
results may vary,
but this tie usually lasts me a couple sessions of good heavy hooking and catching without detonating;
snags, tailhooking, and mishaps with pliers notwithstanding.

~adam

DFix
10-17-2002, 09:09 AM
I've got a charity donation (tie hairwing streamers) to do by November 8. I could throw a half-dozen together for this, hopefully by end of October. Won't be offended if no is the answer, maybe it helps to fill void.

pmflyfisher
10-17-2002, 07:16 PM
Steelheader69 is this swaps fly meister. He must be fishing has not been around for a while. Sure would be OK need to tie 7 flies and send to him see his home address in this thread.

pmflyfisher
10-20-2002, 11:44 AM
Steelheader69, (Jerry)

Whats the status or are you busy out chasing PNW salmon and steelies ? Can't blame you if you are.

Hope all is well.

Hal

Steelheader69
10-21-2002, 12:41 AM
Been down fishing kings/cohos last week. Been crushing them. Caught a few kings in the 40+ range, and some near state record silvers. I'll try and post a picture of a beast I caught. Plus, got Rivergal into another nice king, a 27# hen. Woohoooo. Chrome bright. Was a great week. So I'm feeling generous. Go ahead and extend the deadline.

Steelheader69
10-21-2002, 12:44 AM
Rivergal and myself with a limit of fresh kings. Mine was just a legal adult, gracing 29". But RG had the score with this 27# hen. WHat a way to end out the week. Was a great week, great weather, and great fishing. WHat more can I ask for, ummmm, but another week of vacation??

pmflyfisher
10-21-2002, 08:01 PM
Those are some nice healthy looking salmon.

Nice job !!

Steelheader69
10-23-2002, 02:44 PM
Thanks Hal, was a good week. But alot of ole' dark ones as well. Tribs are so low fish are stacking up at mouths of tribs. Luckily, we stayed away from them. Dark fish are fun to catch at times, but I prefer to stay away from them if I can.

Gave the ole' RPL a test a time or two. Hit a few pockets of silvers and they were greadily eating my flies. Then bonus came when a king interecepted one in THREE FEET OF WATER!!!!!!!!!!! The river I fish, most of the kings are at 15' usually. Hit a pocket of silvers and pulled out a king. Damned, I love that shrimp pattern. LOL. Hole was a good 25' deep, and kings were deep. But one came up near surface. Didn't fly fish that often, only on the tide changes where we anchored up and waited.


Did someone say they wanted to join the fly swap? If someone else wants to join, I'll give up my extra fly. Let me know.

Jerry

pmflyfisher
10-23-2002, 02:58 PM
Need those new patterns for my upcoming steelhead journies, don't wait to long, PLEASE. :D

nbrandon
10-26-2002, 12:16 PM
I sent my flies out first class today, so Jerry should get them in 2-3 days.

I tied 4 size 4 spey flies and because things were so hectic for the past week - I'm getting married this afternoon - I filled in the remaining 3 with tube flies.The tube flies I had tied up for a quick round of fishing this morning, but on the advice of several parties I was persuaded not to go. I thought you guys might put them to good use. The tubes are a pattern a local guide uses for big browns. The speys are just a orange and purple pattern that I've been tying.

I guess if you have a preference on what you get, you should let Jerry know. If you get a tube and you really wanted a fly, or get a fly and really want a tube, send me a message and i'll mail you whatever you want when I return from VEGAS!

Later,
Neil

pmflyfisher
10-26-2002, 12:40 PM
Neil.

Our best wishes for a wonderful wedding and honeymoon, bet you will not be doing much steelheading in Vegas, thanks for getting the flies in before the actual marriage event, look forward to them being a great lakes steelheader like you. I will have to get up to wisconsin rivers more thats an objective for 2003.

All the best

Hal

pmflyfisher
11-03-2002, 11:21 AM
OK, where are we at on this ?

By our great lakes steelhead and salmon season calendar we are now into November which we consider the last month of our Autumn season. December starts the winter fishery, (best times of the year:D for those serious cold weather chrome chasers).

aknightinak
11-03-2002, 01:27 PM
need to light a small fire under my a$$.
I'll work on getting to the PO Monday or Tuesday.

Steelheader69
11-03-2002, 04:48 PM
I do believe we have 6 participants (including myself), and only 3 sets of flies. So still have 3 sets hanging out (one of 3 sets is myself).

Hey Hal, since you are always so quick on sending flies in, I may send you a care package early. Some of my select flies for winter runs (and some summerrun flies since I know you guys have lower/clearer conditions most of the year). Then I'll send you out the rest when they show up. Sound like a deal? Even send you a couple of my own steelhead muddlers.

Light a fire??? How about spark some napalm under their butts. :hehe:

pmflyfisher
11-03-2002, 07:12 PM
JERRY,

Now that sounds wonderful, by the way, we have the lowest and clearest fall river flows now that I can remember in the 23 years I have lived in the great lakes. Rivers all over are low, our runs of fish have been way down, either they are still in the lakes or the lake michigan sport fishers cleaned up on them since they supposedly stayed much more shallower this year giving the charter boats more chances at them.

Muddlers, I love muddlers just can't tie them very well. Something to work on. Now I am perfecting some new michigan hex patterns.

Send them out when ever.

Best

Hal

P.S. When is the winter steelhead swap? :devil:

ashley
11-04-2002, 05:12 PM
Jerry,
Have you got my flies yet?just wondering

Ashley

juro
11-06-2002, 05:27 PM
Just got back into town, red eye straight into work. Embarassing moments at a meeting offsite w/ partner :o

Anyway, I will put together my mail parcel before or during this weekend.

thanks for waiting and doing this

Steelheader69
11-07-2002, 01:13 AM
Yep, have your flies Ashley. Gonna put nail in that swap this weekend.

Ok Juro, just waiting on yours, AK, and someone elses (trying to remember who).

Steelheader69
11-10-2002, 02:53 PM
Ok, I'm waiting on three sets of flies. Juro, Nbrandon, and Aknightak. Then I can finalize the swap. I think Ashley would want his flies, he has a double set coming (he's doing two of my swaps, this one and the international one as well).

Hey Hal, sent that little care package. I included 2 different sized steelhead muddlers (my version) and two drift flies that you might be able use as well.

juro
11-10-2002, 03:18 PM
I got 'em twistin! They will go into tomorrow's mail.

6 for the swap, one extra for the meister.

Steelheader69
11-10-2002, 05:41 PM
Actually Juro, will go out in mail Tuesday, Veteran's day tomorrow.

Hey hal, I goofed too. I think I sent you 3 different sized muddlers. All purple with black head. My mistake on that one.

pmflyfisher
11-10-2002, 06:50 PM
Jerry,

Know problem the fly boxes are low on Muddlers, actually I fly I used to use a lot back east for trout, but have fallen away from it lately. Probably time for me to get reacquainted with it.

A great classic fly for sure.

Hal

Steelheader69
11-13-2002, 06:36 PM
I stand corrected. Nbrandon has sent his flies in. I totally spaced, until I was cleaning out my fly tying desk and found the package. So all I'm waiting for is Juro's and AK's flies.

juro
11-14-2002, 01:56 AM
Well friends, mine went out in this morning's mail. They would have been mailed yesterday, but to your point the doors were locked.

Just to clarify, we will need to get those flies put into the archive with recipes as is customary for all FORUM swaps.

Jerry if you are not able to get them scanned make sure you let me know and I will get images for those I receive. I will then inform people when their pics are ready and they can post the pics with their descriptions of how to tie in the steelhead pattern archive.

If anyone has questions on this fire away. I look forward to receiving my care package!

pmflyfisher
11-14-2002, 10:42 PM
All right now where moving, maybe they will be here by Turkey day what a nice present that would be.;)

Steelheader69
11-16-2002, 12:19 AM
I have Juro's flies. Only waiting on AK's flies and we'll be good to go. Hal, you should have the flies I sent anyday.

Juro, I have a digital camera now, will take pics and post myself. Just waiting on last set of flies.

pmflyfisher
11-16-2002, 11:20 AM
Nothing yet, maybe today, rolled muddlers, ayh

pmflyfisher
11-17-2002, 01:42 PM
Jerry,

They came in yesterdays mail. Early bird fly swap specials I guess, nice, need the instructions for what I guess is a purple rolled muddler/black head. Those look awesome for our summer runs. PM me on those when you have a chance.

Those other patterns are sparse with the bead heads and should sink quickly.

Thanks again will send you out of some of my new colored wire body flies which I think will work on your salmon and steelhead. Still perfecting them a little, but all indications are these will swim deep down to the big boys quickly.

Best

Hal

Steelheader69
11-20-2002, 06:38 PM
Yeah, those are my own "steelhead muddlers". I prefer to go away from the standard feather wing and add a fur marabou wing. Does really well.

Hope to have AK's flies here pretty soon. Once I get his, I'm set to send them out.

aknightinak
11-21-2002, 04:43 PM
s#*t-s#*t-s#*t
grovel, grovel
on the way - priority, which actually is 2-3 days out of Alaska (30-60 days to Alaska)

Steelheader69
11-24-2002, 07:41 PM
Ok, got the last set of flies and all will go out in mail tomorrow. My fly is on the lower right hand side. It's my version of a purple peril spey. The rest of you can lay claim to your own. :D

By the way, have this posted on the fly archives. Go give your detailed description there. Thanks.

http://www.piscatorialpursuits.com/uploads/UP1712.jpg