How Many of Us are There ? [Archive] - Fly Fishing Forum

: How Many of Us are There ?


pmflyfisher
04-30-2002, 07:13 AM
Who are the Great lakes fly salmon and steelhead FF on the forumn ?

Just wondering, I know we are in the minority to the PNW and east coast salt water FFs.

Hal

MikeB
05-01-2002, 04:50 PM
no msg.

pmflyfisher
05-01-2002, 10:57 PM
There are a heck of lot more great lakes fly fishers than you and I.

Where are they all ?

Must be lurking out there and not participating

fredaevans
05-01-2002, 11:38 PM
into paying my airfare ..... I could be one to!:devil:
fe

Sometimes having a wife whose a travel guide in Europe is the pits; if I want to see her more than once in the next four months I've got to burn a lot of 'frequent flyer miles.'

Amazing what a guy will do to get a piece..... none of your business...:eek:

pmflyfisher
05-02-2002, 05:18 PM
See how lonely I am out here with all of this great lakes fishing ? only one other person has responded.

This is great, please don't tell anyone.

Carl
05-15-2002, 09:50 PM
Carl from Grand Haven. I don't post that often, but I'm around. Good to see you like the SC 1378. Occasionally you'll catch Bob B and others from the Wisconsin side hereabouts.

pmflyfisher
05-15-2002, 11:33 PM
Carl,

I envy you being that close to the heart of Michigan's steelhead country.

Are you a spey rod fisher also. Was surprised , when I was up there three weeks ago never saw another spey fisher.

Hal

fredaevans
05-16-2002, 12:19 AM
Same thing here on the Rogue. "They" tell me there are a 'lot' of folks with spey rods ... bull s..... Don't think 95% of the fishermen around here have even seen one.
fe

pmflyfisher
05-16-2002, 07:30 AM
I will have to tell my HR department to classify me as a minority.

steelheadmike
05-16-2002, 03:41 PM
You can count me in as one. I have only fished Lake Ontario and a few of its tribs. This year I plan on MI and PA

steelheadmike
05-16-2002, 03:48 PM
I have always wanted to throw the double handers so I bought and built one this year. I still have not put the flex coat on, but its all wrapped and ready to be finished. Its been that way for 2 months!! Got side tracked with the Stripers in the Hudson River in Mid Feb. I have to pick up some books and videos on casting. Not many people by me use them or want to learn.

Spey Clave in NY or PA for Skamania?? Interesting idea hmmmmmmm....

pmflyfisher
05-16-2002, 04:00 PM
Yes there was one in Milwaukee last year with Dec Hogan. Found out to late to attend, and work and son's football schedule would not allow anyways.

Maybe there will be another one soon or we can have our Fred Evans come out and run it for us and bring in the PNW subject matter experts, etc...

Used to water ski in the Hudson above the Tappan Zee bridge and did some business in Beacon, NY for a few weeks 20 years ago. Local took me to a zipperlip trout stream near Beacon.

Always wondered how the striper fishing was up there but since the stripers have come back it looks like it is pretty good from your reports.

steelheadmike
05-16-2002, 05:09 PM
I know of a few Zipper Lipped spots where there are healthy numbers of Bow's and Browns ( some in the 3-8lb range ) most are small however but there are good #'s. One spot you can hook Rainbows and Browns upstream, Smallies mid river and Arm wrenching Stripers on the low half!! All that and its a 5-10 minute car ride to each area. Wild hugh? If you ever come out this way give me a hollar. The timing needs to be right to get all 3 at once but there is always some where to go. I actually I am not far from the TZ Bridge or Beacon for that matter.

pmflyfisher
05-16-2002, 09:25 PM
Yes I beleive it. Pretty area up there in the Hudson River Valley.
Rip Van Winkle country.

My wife is a Chicago lady, she never realized how scenic and historical the east was until I moved her there for the first 3 years of marriage.

steelheadmike
05-17-2002, 03:27 PM
I would say I am lucky enough to live in one of the most beautiful area's in the country. I am actually about 45 minute north of Manhattan on the Westchester / Putnam county Border. Good fishing and hunting as well as being close to the city life ( if you like the city, personally not big on it but, hey who am I to judge ? )

pmflyfisher
05-17-2002, 05:35 PM
Worked and went to college in NYC, my company has a major office there so I get there occasionally and am always talking with them. Our offices are at One Liberty Plaza, been out of there since 9/11, but we are going back in September or October to help rebuild that area. We lost 6 people down there on 9/11 one being a close business colleague of mine.

Basically, I am a New Yorker who loves the outdoors, but who was transplanted to the great lakes in 1979 due to family and work.

Lots of great water and country here in the great lakes states get out here some time.

pmflyfisher
05-18-2002, 06:50 PM
We know there are more out there lurking somewhere.

Carl
05-18-2002, 06:50 PM
Yes, I spey the Mo', but also the smaller rivers. You're surely right that there are not too many of us, but then consider how many of the salmon/steelhead flyfishers only present with a running line.

pmflyfisher
05-19-2002, 01:30 PM
Carl,

I think I saw more FF indicator fishing this year with floating lines versus Chuck n Duckers with running lines. Saw quite a few sink tip FF also, maybe the transition is underway ?

I am mostly sink tip with some floating line on the spey and single handers.

May your swings be deep and drag free !

PM

Pat Bahan
05-24-2002, 10:39 AM
Not as much as I would like. So far I've only hit the Indiana stretch of the St. Joe. I keep thinking I'll take a week or so and work my way up the west side of Michigan. (like to see if Supinski, Linseman et al are exagerating or not) :hehe:
Am especially interested in checking the St. Marie for Atlantics.

pmflyfisher
05-27-2002, 10:45 AM
Pat,

Welcome glad to see there are more out there lurking. I lived in South Bend until 86 only fished the Indiana stretch of Joe for smallmouth then which was great. In Chicago since. Been fishing all of the Western Michigan streams and some Wisconsin since 1980. When I was in SB the salmon and steelhead never made it past Berrien Springs and Niles. For premier steelie and salmon fly water go north of grand rapids to gods country. If you want more information PM me.

Best,

Hal

Chrome4life
06-11-2002, 03:01 PM
I am an Avid flyfisherman for steelhead, salmon and tout!!! I fish the rivers of the Great Lakes to the Great Lakes themsleves for steelhead and salmon in the Surf. I using primarly 9'-10' rods. I have leaned away from chuck and duck primarly because I find using indicators and a few shot more exciting. I live in southeastern michigan. My home river is the Clinton River. I do fish the Pm, Muskegon, Crystal, Platte, Boardman, Betsie, and many other feeder creeks. If any of you want to hook up some time and fish, just send me a P.M.!! Below is a Pic of an Nice buck from the Clinton.

Email me sometime Chrome4life@yahoo.com

pmflyfisher
06-11-2002, 03:56 PM
Welcome, I am in Chicago and mainly a sink tip spey and single hander for steelhead. Fish all of the rivers in western michigan and some in wisconsin. Can't get myself to use indicators brought up a trout nymph fisherman for forty years now, those things just don't feel or look right on the end of my line. But I can seen their advantages.

Does not look like the picture made it on.

Give it another try.

BTW, never heard of the Crystal, must be one of those michigan zipperlips, eh...

dansteelieman
06-11-2002, 04:51 PM
I am a newbie as well. My passion is surf fishing to cruising salmonoids on the beaches of the Great Lakes. River fishing is great as well, but nothing is better than walking miles along the shorline, looking for no name creeks, and hoping to hookup with somemykiss! Beach Bumin' is great!

BigDave
06-21-2002, 01:42 PM
Hey PMFlyfisher,

Your'e not alone out there! I took my first trips to the NY Tribs last year and had a blast. Will be back for multiple trips this year to do battle with the 25# kings on my 9wt and then to the Oak and Sandys for Browns & Steel in November. Just an incredible fishery. I just could not beleive how hard those big Kings fought! Brutal!

Dave

pmflyfisher
06-21-2002, 02:59 PM
Yep they are brutal I started getting into them in 1979 in Michigan and have had 30 fish on days, left the stream an exhausted, beaten, but oh so happy man. Remember one day must have went 0 for 20 they were fresh and mean. Breaking 20 lb test leaders like they were 6 lb leaders.

I am originally from Northern NJ grew up fly fishing the catskill rivers. In midwest since 1979, live in Chicago now.

Never fished the NY Lake Ontario rivers but they sound good from what I have read.

"Great Lakes Great Times"

Look forward toward your reports from that region.

Hal

pmflyfisher
01-29-2003, 04:18 PM
Any new GL fly fishers joined us lately ? (Particularly steelheaders :d)

I think there are a few since this thread was last accessed.

Let us know who you are and where you are.

PM Out

SDHflyfisher
01-29-2003, 04:52 PM
i'd like to go but i am a little preoccupied with the trout. have gone once or twice but no luck maybe this spring and fall

peter-s-c
01-29-2003, 06:02 PM
doing the conference thing . . . .

Hey, you know I'm here. :D

HERON
01-29-2003, 10:26 PM
I am one to been fishing the long rod since 1988 .

removed_by_request
01-29-2003, 10:46 PM
Most GL fishers post on TSS, hopefully they will stay there.

Commercialized Steelhead fishing is all that is.

BobK
01-30-2003, 08:28 AM
As you know, Hal, I am a Lake O. trib fisherman. Personal preference is to catch the steelies and browns, and don't go after the salmon when the run is in progress. Why?

Well, it's because of the "wall to wall" fishermen, and the blatant snagging and foul hooking, and the lack of sportsmanship and courtesy exhibited by the mobs.

NY screwed up in the early years of the fishery by legalizing snagging. Michigan Crickets were the prime "lure", and I wouldn't go. Now they outlawed it, but it was too late. Taught too many fishermen that snagging was productive. Finally, they outlawed J-plugs this year.

I like flyfishing, but am not a snob. I don't care what type of tackle you use, as long as it's legal. But please, no blatant snagging.

So I go after the salmon runs when the mobs drop off, and while still somewhat crowded, the guys I share the stream with are a better class of sportsmen, and a lot of C&R fishing goes on. (Why keep a fish to eat, when they are loaded with PCBs and Mirex?)
Good fishing, guys, and keep your rod bent!

BobK

cohocola
01-30-2003, 09:04 AM
I live in Ohio just 20 miles from Lake Erie...

I fish Conneaut Creek and the Grand River for Steelheads and Salmon. :D

removed_by_request
01-30-2003, 09:05 AM
Originally posted by BobK


(Why keep a fish to eat, when they are loaded with PCBs and Mirex?)

BobK

Your above statement should put a dent in the snagger population.

Many of the GL DNR's really screwed up when they legalized snagging. Seems like it is bred in them now, they have started patrols on the Big Man. in Mi. it has helped to ease snagging a bit. Proble m is these guys just pack up and move to another unpatrolled river or section of the same river.

I always felt the best thing would be create a section on river where it is legal to snag. These guys won't stop anyway and at least we congragate them. Hopefully they will prey on each other for grandpa's prime snagging spot. Since we can't stop it restrict it. Make it from sept. 15th thru Oct 15th. It may work, they would be easier to watch and arrest if they happen to break any laws.

Lipripper
01-30-2003, 09:26 AM
I think they should make it legal to snag the snaggers. A 15' 10wt should do the trick. A nice solid hook set would really dig that 4/0 down into the shoulder blade. Ooooohhhh Baby! Listen to that reel scream!!! Now thats sporting! :whoa: :tsk_tsk:

LR

pmflyfisher
01-30-2003, 09:26 AM
To think a year ago we did not even have a great lakes section on the board except for Peter S-C then he disappeared for 8 months. I figured he found a better candian great lakes board to spend his time. Now thankfully he is back with us.

It was just me trying to hold my own with the PNW steelheaders and the few european and north american atlantic salmon fly fisherman on the forumn.

Now we have a thriving and growing great lakes member population.

I don't feel so lonely anymore.:chuckle:


PM Out

P.S. Peter SC did you bring your vise and materials with you for the lonely business seminar hours in your room or just a couple of fly fishing magazines like I usually do ?

nbrandon
01-30-2003, 09:57 AM
I'm a GL steelheader also, though this year I haven't been doing very well.

Neil

removed_by_request
01-30-2003, 12:15 PM
It is amazing, that there are so many GL fishermen.:D

All this while I thought there wer only 3 of us.

peter-s-c
01-30-2003, 04:48 PM
Originally posted by pmflyfisher

P.S. Peter SC did you bring your vise and materials with you for the lonely business seminar hours in your room or just a couple of fly fishing magazines like I usually do ?

Naw, we do this three or four times a year and the evenings are usually spent sampling Montreal's fine restaurants. I usually arrive back at the hotel in a condition that is not conducive to tying. Did you know that Montreal sidewalks move from side-to-side late at night? Darn hard to walk on - very inconsiderate of them.

:o

dansteelieman
01-30-2003, 04:57 PM
Don't forget me!:D

pmflyfisher
01-30-2003, 06:01 PM
Dan,

Definitely not, great job on the Michigan Spey Clave so far. I am impressed. Wish I could help but my corporation has about 7 800 pound gorillas on my back right now, and its growing.

Corporate madness 2003 style !! Its getting worse.

PM Out

dansteelieman
01-30-2003, 06:11 PM
Hal I look foward to meeting you, we view our fishery the same and I believe it is just as fine as the Upper Pacific NW fishery for steelhead.

The clave is going to be hot!:D I will save a spot for you!;)

Pat Bahan
01-30-2003, 08:46 PM
I've been off the forum to long. Sounds like I've missed all sorts of fun. Duck & goose season is now over so I can return my attention to piscatorial persuits. :hehe:
Hal- send me your snail-mail. I have a patern for you to try.

pmflyfisher
01-30-2003, 08:58 PM
Pat,

Welcome back, how was duck and goose season, get any good feathers ?

Hows Hoosier land, I was down at ND in November.

Whats the secret fly ? I love secret flies !!!

Will PM you my home address.

PM Out

Pat Bahan
01-30-2003, 09:26 PM
Hi Hal,
Duck & goose hunting was good. Lots of duck gumbo & Teriyaki goose brests.
You'wd probably kick my hinnie if you knew how many mallard feathers I wasted.
The fly in question is a mymph patern I concocted. (It was also the patern on which I caught my first steely) As best I can tell it is unique although it definantly borrows heavily from other paterns.

pmflyfisher
01-30-2003, 09:30 PM
Pat,

Don't waste those bronze mallard feathers please.

Check your private messages.

PM Out

Pat Bahan
01-30-2003, 09:35 PM
Hi Hal,
Duck & goose hunting was good. Lots of duck gumbo & Teriyaki goose brests.
You'wd probably kick my hinnie if you knew how many mallard feathers I wasted.
The fly in question is a mymph patern I concocted. (It was also the patern on which I caught my first steely) As best I can tell it is unique although it definantly borrows heavily from other paterns.

Pat Bahan
01-30-2003, 09:55 PM
I'm still scratching my head trying to figure out how I managed to double post the previous message.:eyecrazy: :whoa:
Anyway, the patern I'm sending is basically a large stonefly type patern with a "pearl Diamond Braid" abdomen. Mostly I use orange but chartruse seems to work too. I think you would say it's more of a stimulator.

pmflyfisher
01-30-2003, 10:06 PM
Pat

Sounds very interesting I am always interested in another good steelhead nymph pattern to add to the arsenal.

PM Out

removed_by_request
01-31-2003, 09:46 PM
It always makes me wonder why a steelhead would strike a chart or pink even orange nymph.

Perhaps at times their eyes are like dogs(they can't see color), or maybe they can't see colors in certain spectrums.

pmflyfisher
01-31-2003, 11:11 PM
Who knows sometimes I think color does not matter much when you find a "player (aggressive) " steelhead, but most times I like to use natural colors which will take the "players" and the "neutral" ones which may be tempted when they see a natural food form come by and their memory kicks in to the conditioned response to strike a food source.

Sounds good doesn't it ? But when you see a piece of yarn catch them you wonder about the whole fly color issue. ;)

PM Out

dansteelieman
01-31-2003, 11:50 PM
Supinski's term of player has hit us all....I thought I was the only one saying it:D

Anyways, steelhead can see colors I believe, that is what I was told by a biologist.

pmflyfisher
02-01-2003, 12:02 AM
Not sure where I picked up that term have to check, but believe it was before I read "Steelhead Dreams" last winter. Might have been one of MS's magazine articles.

I agree those are the fish you want to find.

Pm Out

BobK
02-01-2003, 12:09 AM
Assuming any person could know what a trout "sees", (and I do believe they can see color - or why do their colors brighten up for spawning - especially the males?), there are many other factors influencing color vision in the water. Turbidity (muddiness or clarity), time of day, moon or no moon at night, depth, etc.

Also, why do they strike purple or black eggs? Look in their stomachs - often they take sticks, grass, bottle caps, and other flotsam.

While in the service, and overseas, I had a "pack rod" and a spinning reel, with a few lures - spoons and spinners. When I ran out of lures, I used to take little P-38 c-ration can openers, bend them slightly, tie a hook to 'em, and STILL catch fish!

I think a lot of it is instinctive behavior. If something looks like food, acts like food, (and if it smells like food, even better!) and is getting away, they nail it. If it looks like an invasion of territory, they also nail it.

But with a creature with a brain the size of a small pea, we can only guess.

BobK

removed_by_request
02-01-2003, 07:28 AM
I am not saying they do not see color, but perhaps due to the refraction of light thru the water may make colors like Chart. or pink look like brown or gray.

I know they did a bunch of tests in the 80's to see how certain colors changed at different depths it was an amazing study.

Probably the instinct thing helps more than anything.

By the way MS did not coin the phrase "player".

I remember hearing it 20 years ago on one of the good ole boy bass shows. I don't think he coined anything original.:devil:

pmflyfisher
02-01-2003, 08:03 AM
MJYP,

I will research where I saw the term "player", it will come to me just give me a little time.

FYI, the research has been completed and I am fully prepared to start the MS Trivia thread if needed. :devil:

But first there are the Wulff, Schwiebert, R.H. Brown, L. Kreh, T. Coombs, A. Flick, T. Gordon and many other famous fly fishers of trout and salmon trivia threads to work on.

BTW, who do you think are the GLs fly fishing steelhead and salmon pioneers ? Dick Swan and Dave Richey come to mind but they were not solely fly fisherman. It has to be some one who has guided, published articles or books, TV show etc...

Let me know, because no one quickly comes forth from my brain cells

PM Out

dansteelieman
02-01-2003, 08:29 AM
Ray Schmidt, John Kluesing, and the many locals...

removed_by_request
02-01-2003, 08:37 AM
JK is not a pioneer he came later much later. Great caster, but not a pioneer.

I would agree on Ray (who is healing well):) Ray helped developed many Great lakes flies and tatics.

Swan for sure, he got people to believe these fish would bite. Bedford also, even tho' these are not all fly guys they helped open our eyes to the resource we had.

Swan used to take guys out (big lake) put them in a belly boat and have them strip streamers for scum line feeders. I would hazard a guees that is innovative.

BobK
02-01-2003, 11:41 AM
What about Seth Green and the Caledonia Hatchery in NY. I think he was the first (or one of the first) to bring McCloud Rainbows east, and stocked the Genesee River, a trib of Lake Ontario. Some of 'em made their way into the lake. I'm pretty sure that was before 1880. (Just checked - he got the eggs in 1874, first stockings in the Genny in 1879.

I am also pretty sure that pacific salmon were stocked in Lake Erie (and maybe Lake Ontario?) in the 1880s and 1890s. Can't find my reference on that, though. I'm pretty sure the Cattaraugus (feeds Erie) was one of the first. (The info is on one of the web sites pertaining to the Cattaraugus).

Maybe this will be a memory jogger for you.

If we didn't have the fish, there would BE no flyfishing!!! So let's give tribute to the folks who made it happen!

PS - Caledonia hatchery is just a short drive from my home!

BobK

removed_by_request
02-01-2003, 04:00 PM
I'd have to do some digging, but Michigan was one of the first GL states to plant Steelhead. They even had returns (small ones at best) during the Lake Michigan's bleak years.

These guys were not Ffishers they were after meat.

pmflyfisher
02-01-2003, 04:43 PM
Don't forget the great michigan fishery biologists who lead the research and initial stockings of lake michigan in the 1960s : Howard Tanner, Dave Borgerson, Paul Seebach, Leo Mroszinski, etc. they managed the early michigan steelhead and salmon programs. The Little Manistee strain is now the largest stocked strain through out the great lakes. A hardy strain they are.

PM Out

removed_by_request
02-01-2003, 07:02 PM
Originally posted by pmflyfisher
MJYP,
BTW, who do you think are the GLs fly fishing steelhead and salmon pioneers ?
PM Out

Hal,

We owe the biologists a hats off but they were not as you asked fly fishing pioneers. Just guys trying to get rid of a problem...alewives.

I always wonder what the first guy thought we he pegged one of our silver pigs while fishing for perch or trout.

Bet he was awe struck.

pmflyfisher
03-09-2003, 12:00 PM
Pat,

I like the stone fly pattern and am preparing to tie some. Did you get my care package yet ?

PM Out

Pat Bahan
03-09-2003, 08:47 PM
Hal,
Yes! I should have replied sooner but I've been bad. Except for church and taking the wife to Sunday lunch I've spent all weekend fishing and/or rigging.:hehe:
I'm very impressed with some of your ideas and am looking forward to copying them. Many thanks.:D

pmflyfisher
03-09-2003, 10:05 PM
Pat,

No problem, just let me know when your headed up steelhead fishing, so I don't go to the same river you are on that day and have to compete with you using some of those fly patterns.

If you have any questions on any of those patterns shoot me a PM or email

Have to start using those feathers also, got some great ideas for their use. :D

Hal

PM Out