Tube Fly hooks ..... beyond Tiemco 105's [Archive] - Fly Fishing Forum

: Tube Fly hooks ..... beyond Tiemco 105's


fredaevans
02-25-2002, 04:17 PM
Have been using this Tiemco hook (usually the tuber's hook of choice for steelhead) but I'm missing fish right and left. Head shake, back on the spey, a head shake and gone. Hooks just don't seem to be 'penitrating' like they should. And the buggers are SHARP.

But normally I use a thin wire hook for my patterns regardless of size or weight. Any suggestions for a short shank, ring eye hook in the size 2-4 range?
fe

Willie Gunn
02-25-2002, 04:31 PM
Fred.
I'll post some Wilson out point trebles. Three times the hooking power. Are they legal in the former colonies.

Malcolm

andre
02-25-2002, 06:10 PM
dia ichi 2151, 2451

GBSkunk
02-25-2002, 07:00 PM
Fred, I use the Tiemco 105 on my plastic tubes and I use the Daiichi X510 on the metal tubes with the soft "aquarium" type tubing adaptor. I have not been real happy with the X510. It's a heavier wire with a X-point. It's difficult to sharpen and does not hold a point very well.

I recently went to http://www.partridge-of-redditch.co.uk and saw that Partridge is now offering special tube fly treble hooks. It's called the SALAR Treble hook. They're brand new. Apparently they have a small narrow eye that goes into the tube better. I'm thinking of ordering some in a size 7 or maybe a 5.

In the mean time I'm going back to the Tiemco 105 in a size 4. I'd use a size 2 if they made it.

TL's,
Dave

pescaphile
02-25-2002, 07:33 PM
See if you can find some of the discontinued TMC 800Bs. They're A stout short-shanked ring-eyed steelhead hook and are ideal for tubes. The shank is just slighttly longer in proportion than is the 105s. You might have to put out a plea on the web but there ought to be some out there somewhere. A size 4 800B is significantly larger than a size 4 105 and along with a size 6 is a good size for tubes.

Good Luck
pesacaphile

NrthFrk16
02-25-2002, 10:39 PM
Fred-
I am not a tube fly fisherman (yet :devil: ) but I have a good customer who has started fishing them exclusively.

He swears by the wide gap saltwater fly hooks avaliable through Gamakatsu. They are sharper then anything on the market and have a killer bend...I've got 1. Will throw it an envelope if you would like... :)

pmflyfisher
02-26-2002, 05:31 AM
Fred

Macolm (aka Willie Gunn) has some good looking Partridge English Carp hooks he sent to be used on his AS Willie Gunn fly.

They look pretty stout. Probably have to order from UK

Hal

Willie Gunn
02-26-2002, 02:22 PM
Hooks and hooking fish.
Fred’s question about hooks drove me to my books to give a better answer than posting some trebles. In modern times doubles and trebles have been the hooks of choice for Salmon fishing in the UK.

Hooking properties of Singles.
Historically LA Smithes friend A.H.E. Wood was a great believer in single hooks. He preferred very long hooks with a short dressing, as he believed the hook would grip further back in the fish’s mouth. I am too young to pass comment on this theory but note that he lost about 50% of the fish that took.
In order for a single hook to penetrate flesh and stick the hook must be lying at right angles to the jaw, if the hook is lying parallel to the jaw the hook may pull straight out. With this in mind some anglers insist on an offset. Apparently worm drowners prefer Mustards 80500 Professional which have their points slanted down and away from the plane of the hook.

Doubles.
Have the advantage that they cannot lie flat. One or other of the hooks should always be at an angle to hook into flesh. Some anglers believe that is only one hook is attached the other leg can help lever the hook free, I am not convinced by this argument.

Trebles.
I have for most of my fishing time fished trebles so I am biased. I do not believe that the extra weight makes any difference to how deep the fly fishes as once a long wing is tied in the extra leg(s) makes little difference compared with the amount of dressing. Most trebles are outpoints which provide positive penetration of flesh as they are pulled forward.

Questions? Fred.

Have your hooks an offset? Have you tried hooks with an offset?

Hal. The Carp hooks I sent do not have an offset but have a nice wide gape.

pmflyfisher
02-26-2002, 05:27 PM
Malcolm,

Yes a a very nice wide gap they have , looks like a good sturdy tube (and carp) hook ?

Have to get some for the tube flies I am starting to tie.

Hal

fredaevans
02-26-2002, 11:16 PM
a short shank ring eye hook of considerable 'metal.' Not huge buggers, but pretty stiff metal vis a vis a 'regular' wire fly hook. Think this is why the hook gets the initial 'prick' but not good penitration. I'm pretty fast on the initial take so hook doesn't get to slide into the corner of the mouth. It's in the front lip, or nothing.

Anyway, back to the search; will look for some of the above suggested hooks on line.
fe

NrthFrk16
02-26-2002, 11:32 PM
If you get an envelope with just a single hook in it, it is probally from me. :devil:

I've got a few differnt things I have to mail out tomorrow and I'll throw a hook in the mail for 'ya. :)

Dana
02-27-2002, 01:48 AM
It was kinda funny--I tried to get these a few seasons back from a source in the UK. The person I spoke to on the phone was horrified that I would ask a shop that dealt only in tackle for game angling if they had any carp hooks. When I asked if they had any corn or maggots the line went dead. Sorta reminded me of that famous story that came out of the Ponoi some years back, about the Duke that the American guides kept calling "Duke"--not "Sir Duke" or "Mr. Duke", just "Duke", as in "'mornin', Duke!", or "How's the fishin', Duke?" or "Get any, Duke?" I think this chap went back to his estate with a comment that Americans should not be allowed on salmon rivers. :tsk_tsk:

Anyways, Hunter's has them over here under the sexier name "Nordic Single Tube Fly Hook." They are killer. I compared these to the 105s last season and I found these helped me keep a few more fish on. Problem is every time I order a bunch I have to "lend" a few packs to kush, so I always end up short. And yes I have to "lend" them to kush. He's bigger than me.:eek:

NrthFrk16
02-27-2002, 02:21 AM
Fred and others who enjoy the tube-
I looked around for a picture online of the hook that a customer of ours swears by but I couldnt find one. So I went ahead and just scanned the hook...

Anyways, its a Gamakatsu saltwater flyhook. Sorry I do not have the exact stock number at this time.

fredaevans
02-27-2002, 01:25 PM
Was 'putting through' the Hunter's catalog on my desk this morning and happened to see this Partridge MM3ST Nordic Single Tube Fly Hook at $10.95 per 25 pack. They have them in size 2-8's so suspect that the smaller ones go to the lighter wire idea. Will give them a "credit card call" this morning and see how much this is going to cost me.

Sigh ... never heard of a man on his death bed say "Damn, wish I'd never bought that ......."
:eyecrazy:

MikeB
03-01-2002, 10:10 PM
Hi Fred,
You might want to think about trying the Kamasan B983 Wide Gape Specialist hook, probably in a size 2 if they make it. I am going to try this hook on some tubes I have tied for here in Ontario. I know this is an amazing hook in terms of its strength to diameter ratio (high carbon content in the steel) because I use it when employing (ummm) 'alternate methods' to catch steelhead. I'm still in the transition so don't hate me!!:tsk_tsk:

Mike

fredaevans
03-04-2002, 06:28 AM
Mike
Don't think I've even heard of this brand of hooks. Can you direct me to a place 'on-line' that stocks them?

"Alternative" ..... ???? This isn't anything that requires "consenting Adults" is it??
:devil:

juro
03-04-2002, 07:10 AM
Per the scanned gami -

That's a pretty widely used SW gamakatsu hook on the striper scene. I use it a lot for my silverside patterns.

Our sponsor Blue Northern Trading Co. (978) 772-6779 carries several sizes of them, although the emphasis is on larger sizes for stripers and other coastal gamefish. They are S/S and only come in silver. Razor sharp and I could see how the bend would work for tube flies in colors that work with a silver hook. Would make a great coho fly hook as well unless you're tying tandem where you need a bendback eye.

Tell them where you heard about it if you guys call. I have some in my tying kit but in nothing smaller than a #1.

NrthFrk16
03-04-2002, 12:07 PM
Fred-
The guys that fish those hooks fish them in sizes 1/0 and 1 so if the shop that Juro mentioned carries them in those sizes, then you will be all set! :)

MikeB
03-04-2002, 02:51 PM
Hi Fed,
I don't have any on-line retailers that I know stock this hook, as I can buy them through a local shop, but let me do some looking around to see what I can find for you.

Mike

Adrian
03-04-2002, 03:25 PM
I was wondering about dealing with a hook which you like the size / shape of but don't want silver. Some folks paint em but then I remembered some touch up "blueing fluid" which I used to have for dealing with scuffs on shotgun barrels. Nasty stuff to handle but the modern equivalent comes in a set of three felt pens. One to prep, one to "blue" and one to fix the color. At $3.95 it sounded like a worthwhile experiment. I'll post results in due course!

fredaevans
03-09-2002, 04:10 AM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by MikeB
[B]Hi Fed,
I don't have any on-line retailers that I know stock this hook, as I can buy them through a local shop, but let me do some looking around to see what I can find for you.

Mike

Mike, I'd appreciate it very much. Had to dash to the town of Rogue River to drop some papers off with a Realtor so killed my lunch break on the bank. Had a 'pre-rigged' rod in the car with a two- tube fly set up, each with single 105's. 30 minutes of fishiing, two missed fish. Same horse poop as above. Feel fish, tighten up on fish, feel fish's head jurk around .... feel nothing.:mad:

pmflyfisher
03-09-2002, 04:44 AM
Fred,

Here is the link to the "Jack Hilton Carp Hooks" Malcolm (aka Willie Gunn) sent for the atlantic salmon fly swap. Malcolm sent the black nickle version.

I can say they look like a very sturdy wide gap hook. If they can handle those 30-40 pound UK carp they can handle the 5-15 lb Rogue steelhead for sure.

Doubt if you will find these in the states. Online order from your UK shops though should do it.

I am looking for a good double tube fly hook now. In Michigan you can fish double hooks, but no trebles. Any recommendations Malcolm or anyone else ?


http://www.partridge-of-redditch.co.uk/Hooks/CARP/carp26.htm

fredaevans
03-10-2002, 10:15 PM
tomorrow. Are these distributed in the US?
FE

Willie Gunn
03-11-2002, 12:55 PM
Fred,
If you require anything from the UK just drop me an email and I will organise it for you.

Malcolm

fredaevans
03-11-2002, 04:31 PM
Do these come in different size hooks? (Ya, I know that sounds like a dumb question. But 'selection' could be limited). And if so how much for a pack of (however many are in a pack). Would like to try them in 4's, 6's and 8's-if they get that small.
fe

Willie Gunn
03-11-2002, 04:48 PM
Hi Fred,
I'll work on it tommorrow as it is bed time now 22.48.

Malcolm