Snap-T [Archive] - Fly Fishing Forum

: Snap-T

08-31-2005, 02:29 PM
Casting from either bank, my snap T always casts very square. I can't seem to get less than about 80 degrees. What might I be doing wrong? Does anyone have any ideas?

Also, from left bank, medium to strong upstream wind- what's the best cast?

08-31-2005, 03:16 PM
The snap-T is generally designed to be a square angle-change cast but it can be made at a more acute or obtuse angle depending on (1) the plane of the d-loop before the cast (2) how the pull/push is directed and (3) where the anchor lies.

Skipping the details for a minute, as long as you can lay-down this formation in a manner that it can be swept up into a d-loop, the most important thing is that the d-loop is aligned with the forward stroke - follow the 180 degree rule.

However the shape of the line on the water determines the sweeping path, and the sweeping path influences the d-loop - thus pay attention here too.

The shape of the line after the snap is a sort of 'candy cane' or "U" with 54-65 ft lines one leg ends at the rod tip and the longer leg lays on the water with only the anchor and fly upstream of you on the final casting side of the body.

Make all moves with the body, not just the arms...

a) lead the initial lift and pull toward the middle of the river a little more for closed angles

b) when pushing the rod tip underneath, cross to the inside toward the shore a bit more

c) use a shorter belly line for more maneuverability

d) pay special attention to degree of rotation at the end of the sweep - watch the d-loop!

e) wait for the sweep momentum to form the d-loop... after the stop it may take a full second for that d-loop to swell out and back

f) look for the end of the flyline to pivot before making the forward cast, this means the d-loop has formed fully

Lastly make sure the anchor and fly are on the correct side of the cast or risk a hookup of the wrong species ;)

Upriver wind, left bank? My pet cast - the upriver snake is my favorite, but I will use a single spey most often for simplicity and power.

Good luck casting!

beau purvis
08-31-2005, 09:00 PM
I like a snap t with a twist in Juro's river left ,upstream wind situation..the twist is a sidearm delivery when the wind is hard.the sidearm aspect makes evrything rollout and turnover parallel to the water surface.your leader and fly will flip around and land downstream of your line and be ready to fish without a mend.whereas, with the more normal delivery the hard wind will mostly blow the big fly and leader upriver of your line and this will require a hard messy me it is easier to do the sidearm than with a single.also easier to laydown the 2nd cast move of the snap T in a tough wind consistently.BEAU

09-01-2005, 11:20 AM
are you trying to direct the cast more upstream or more downstream?..if you are trying to get more uptream, thne try this...I am not a casting instructor and only can say this works for me in my snap t ....If you right hand is the top hand and you have snapped the line upstream and before it anchors , if you sweep the rod back and downward to the left as far possible without taking it behind you , the effect is to move the anchor in really tight to your right side and with the rod then directed upstream on the forward stroke you can direct the forward and final portion of the cast more upstream..said another way, the further the rod is swept back to the left, the more upstream shot you get on the final cast...

09-01-2005, 11:27 AM
Bee, Beau Purvis and especially Juro once again... thankyou for the tips. I'm heading down to the river over the next few days- I'll try what you have recommended.


Willie Gunn
09-01-2005, 11:28 AM
Does anyone have any ideas?

Learn to single and double spey off both shoulders. Snap (insert letter of choice) is a cast best used in ponds and to impress wee lassies who are watching. All flash and no substance.

Also, from left bank, medium to strong upstream wind- what's the best cast?
Single Spey right hand up, next time you are at Wester Elchies ask Sam Bremner to show you.

beau purvis
09-01-2005, 05:23 PM
on Juro's part of the cast described under b] ,I sort of cast the line below me by puting a good bend in my rod tip and using that to propell a few feet of semi slack line as I follow through down and and around toward shore a little more than where i am standing. that way ,the line on the water ends with a half of a C shape on the downstrem half.That ,to me, is the perfect shape to retrace on the sweep back upstream. It eliminates any extra noise or is a smooth oerfect retracement.also ,I make sure my tip on that move ends in the water. So,before I start the sweep back up , all the line and the tip are on the water.If I do that every time ,the fly is anchored in the same spot above my body every time, eliminating any variation of the anchor and giving me a smooth, even ,continous build of load from the moment I start the upriver sweep prior to final delivery.By the way ,my first lift move is done with a combination of a down hand push and up hand pull and as soon as it is lifted ,the down stroke is done with a downhand pull and upper hand push combo.I dont really use any arm movement.A lot of people use big arm movements and move the whole hands and arms basically stay pretty much stable in those first two moves and I use an easy push-pull and pull-push making the top half of the rod to do all the work!Beau

09-01-2005, 07:08 PM
Juro and Beau provides tons of good advice. Here's a ounce:

to cast a narrower downstream angle on the snap-T, throw the D-loop more upriver

the anchoring and body tips that Juro and Beau give will make it possible to send the line fully downstream on the final cast, 0 degrees, back to the dangle

09-01-2005, 10:55 PM
Up stream wind on the left bank. You would be crazy to not use a single spey off the right shoulder, quickest way to get the fly back out and fishing. I won't discredit the snap-t as a cast its very useful with very heavy tips and a serious change of direction. But you can achieve the same with the single and use one less move to make the cast. Learn the single and it will be your best friend, practice it off both shoulders and you won't want to use a snap or a double.

beau purvis
09-02-2005, 09:09 AM
I am trying to help with ?'s asked about snap T.!! Not preaching that is the only cast to use,Not that dogmatic!! I try to use all casts.As I have said before everyone is dialed in differently and some can do some casts and others can't.All situations are different also.You cant just say 'river left.upstream wind means single spey or what ever.there can be slight differences that favor certain casts.I usually start with obvious but try other options if my first choice seems to have some less thn desired aspects.At rare times and unusual wind currents the "wrong cast" has worked best!I also just like to change and experiment to give my muscles and my brain a single from river left is also a weak cast for me.I tend to do the single on river right ,upstram wind , especially when using a floating line.I use the single much more with a floating line for some reason.I find it interesting that the dogmatic ones argue against the snap T because there is an extra move required. Yet, they use the double spey in a downriver wind .you would think that that same resoning would drive them towards the snake.Must be tradition rather than efficiency!Any way thats my dribble ,for what ever it is worth!!Beau

09-02-2005, 10:03 AM
Beau makes and excellent point, we all have individual preferences, skillsets, goals and pleasure points. I do agree with Brian, the single is the 'one' to learn, however that wouldn't be true for all practitioners necessarily.

Years ago I started out just trying to get the damn line out there far enough. The double and snap were my saviors. Then I got consistent with the single, and my left hand came along too. Now, as funny as it seems, when the cast I am doing gets easy I switch to another cast! Call it crazy but I figure "every minute in a groove is a minute I could use to improve". If Ben Franklin was a speybrotha I'm sure he'd coin a phrase like that.

I listed the upriver snake as my favorite but by no means is it the 'best' or worst, easiest or hardest, and it won't necessarily catch more fish. It's just fun :)

09-04-2005, 06:30 PM
was just trying to answer the original question about the best cast river left with a upstream wind. The use of the single spey in that situation is of course only my prefered method. I realize I may have came off with a thats the only way to do it attitude, my bad on that part, I know better, and keep a very open mind when it comes to casting preferences and styles as I tend to use them all.

beau purvis
09-05-2005, 12:30 AM
no problem, I was just trying to clarify I wasnt being dogmatic after Willie"s seemingly gruff retort.I really enjoy experiment and change similar to that expressed by Juro.I also am a little sensitive , since once in a while I have been tackled a little hard!!!But I am a big boy!Beau

Willie Gunn
09-05-2005, 02:11 AM
Moi gruff? what next.
There are only 2 casts to learn the single and the double spey. Left and right hand up, once you can do those well you can fish anywhere. The rest are just patter.

beau purvis
09-05-2005, 09:35 AM
you took my fly. I knew i would draw you back with that one.just playing with you Willie!! By the way, I caught my biggest Kharlovka fish on my first cast in my life with a Willie Gunn on a brass tube.thought of you afterwards.Beau

Willie Gunn
09-05-2005, 04:02 PM
Great fly have you tried it for steelhead on the west coast?
I am still being tempted to fish the Thomson later this year, a Willie Gunn on a full sinker, should do the trick. Single spey cast of course.

I would not last long as a fish I always take the first fly i see.

09-13-2005, 02:29 PM
Malcolm, just make the flight no other questions required. No need for this changing hands and which one to put on top. Just make the dam cast :chuckle:

Work has been a bear

I'll send you a follow up to the email you sent later this week.