vises...? [Archive] - Fly Fishing Forum

: vises...?


flyjkol
04-12-2004, 07:41 PM
Help!!! I need to get a new fly tying vise really bad. I was looking possibly at dynaking's squire or trekker models, a HMH spartan or the renzetti traveler. I need a vise that i can spin deer hair with and will take larger 4/0 hooks. I don't tie anything smaller than size 18. "C" clamp is preferred along with being a cam vise. A rotaryvise would be very nice and I dont want to spend more than $200.

Penguin
04-12-2004, 10:00 PM
E-Bay...
It's always good to support a deserving local shop...
But don't rule out rooting around e-commerce.
Someone is selling just what you're looking for...you just have to turn over enough stones and soonerorlater you connect.
Buy right the first time and you only do it once. IMHO

flytyer
04-12-2004, 10:23 PM
Since you want a vise that will tie 4/0 without hook slippage and also plan on spinning deer hair, I recommend the Dyna King Squire of the ones you listed. The Dyna King Trekker is a close second recommendation for me only because it is a bit smaller than the Squire (although it uses the same jaws). All Dyna Kings use the same superb jaws and cam (the same as on my Dyna King Barracuda, which unfortunately is $325.00 U.S. and over your specified price) that are the best in the business currently.

I would avoid the Renzetti Traveler because it is not the best for holding large hooks. The HMH Spartan is not bad; however, its jaws are not in the same league as those of the Dyna King vises.

Eddie
04-13-2004, 08:10 AM
I second FT's opinion, and I would also take a look at the Regal vice. I think that in that price range (less than 200 bucks) nothing comes close. This is especially true considering that you won't be tying tiny flies (the Regal's weak point).

flyjkol
04-16-2004, 07:55 PM
I've also found a place where I can get a griffin patriot for $120, does any one have any experience with them? It's between that or the baracuda jr.

flytyer
04-16-2004, 08:31 PM
The Griffin Patriot is not a bad vise; however, it is not in the same league as the Barracuda Jr. It doesn't have the superb jaws of the Barracuda Jr, is not made of the same high quality steel, does not have a ball bearing rotation shaft (which means there is quite a lot of jaw arm wobble when tying rotary on the Griffin), does not have an easily adjustable rotation plane, does not have the infinitely adjustable rotation tension, and does not have the ability to lock the vise in non-rotary mode the Barracuda Jr has.

If you want to stay under $200.00 U.S., take a look at one of the Dyna King vises like the Squire. They use the same jaws as the Barracuda and Barracuda Jr and are made out of very high quality steel.

Don't get me wrong, the Griffin vises are good values for the money. They just aren't in the same league as the Dyna Kings. For a beginner's vise, I nearly always recommend a Griffin; but I never recommend a Griffin to a tyer with some experience who is looking to upgrade to a better vise.

The Regal is also a better vise than the Griffin, provided you aren't going to tie smaller than say a #12 or #14.

Salmon Chaser
04-16-2004, 09:11 PM
If you are looking for an inexpensive vise I would suggest the Integra(Regal copy). The two main functions of any vise should be to handle the full range of hooks and to hold them securely.
As a Salmon angler i usually don't go smaller than #14 so am not too sure how they handle #22's,etc,, but I love it for regular duty.
$45 bucks with a c-clamp AND pedestal is too good to pass up. I have friends who have about 8 years and many thousands of tyes on them and are still going strong.
I never bought into the rotation craze,,,,or how a $400 vise ties a better fly than a Thompson A.
Salmon Chaser
><)))*>

flytyer
04-17-2004, 12:26 AM
Salmon Chaser,

Thompson Vise Co. ceased to exist in February of this year. They simply closed their doors and stopped producing any product and let all the employee go. The company never even told their employees that they were going to stop producing product and cease all business until the day it happened when the employee were told they no longer had a job. This means that all Thompson vises no longer have any warantee nor do they have replacement parts available. IMHO, anyone who buys a Thompson vise at full retail at this time is making a mistake because of the company going out of business in February.

I've also worn out many jaws, draw sleeves (collars), and cam handles on Thompson A and Thompson 360 vises. They were never anything more than a serviceable vise that worked fine as long as you didn't tie more than about 10,000 flies on them. If you did, you needed to buy new cam levers, draw sleeves, and jaws on a regular basis.

A quality vise doesn't have these parts wear out. My Dyna King Barracuda has had around 100,000 steelhead flies tied on it in the last 8 years and it has no signs of wear yet.

I'm not trying to be difficult; but I've never seen any cheap copy of any vise hold up very well in the 42 years I've been tying flies. I had a good friend and 2 acquaintences buy the vise you mentione (the Regal $45.00 copy with C-clamp and Pedestal Bases) and all three of them had problems with the vise'sn jaws within 2 years time. These 3 guys don't tie more than 300 flies in a year. They learned the hard way that the cheap copies are money ill spent.

If a person really needs to only spend a little on a tying vise, the Griffin 1A or better the Griffin 2A are the say to go. Decent jaws (even though they are made of mild steel) that hold hooks well that hold a large range of hooks sizes well. And they are both inexpensive, selling for less than $50.00.

The best advice for a fly tying vise is to buy the best that you can afford. And if you have $100.00 and can get together another $100.00 or so in the next 4 to 8 weeks, you should wait until you have the extra $100.oo and get a better vise. Remember that there are no shortcuts to quality machining and quality steel. And a good vise is dependent on both.

If a person realy doesn't want to spend money on a fly tying vise, he should learn to tie without a vise like the best tyers of 100 years ago did because they did not have a decent vise. Lee Wulff never used a vise and he tied flies down to #18 without a problem. Currently, Harry Lemire from right here in WA State ties beautiful classic featherwing full-dressed atlantic salmon flies without a vise.

Smolt
04-17-2004, 10:04 AM
For large hooks, its hard to beat a Dyna-King or a Regal, but I wouldn't sell the Spartan short -- especially if you don't need a true rotary feature. The Spartan with Magnum jaws will hold large hooks with no trouble. I have owned a Spartan, a full-sized HMH, a Renzetti Traveler, and a Renzetti Presntation. I now own a Dyna-King Barracuda which, after taking a little time to get used to working the jaws, I like the best. My $0.02

wrke
04-17-2004, 10:49 AM
Originally posted by flytyer
The Regal is also a better vise than the Griffin, provided you aren't going to tie smaller than say a #12 or #14.

I agree with much of what flytyer says, but with all due respect, this statement is patently absurd. Maybe I'm cheap, old-fashioned, backwards or something but I use a Regal for virtually everything (except my tube flies). I'm not a commercial tyer and haven't tied 100,000 flies, but I've been at it for over 35 years. Most of my trout flies are 18s and smaller as my primary trout fishing is on spring creeks. I tie all the way down to #22 tricos and midges. Now, it might be a little easier to tie small sizes on other vises with smaller jaws, but I've NEVER had a problem. As a matter of fact, one of my friends, the legendary tyer Al Troth (developer of the elk hair caddis among others) I believe still ties on a Regal.
Bill

JDJones
04-17-2004, 11:14 AM
These guys are telling you straight. Do without, or with what you have until you can save enough to to get one of those Dyna Kings. You mentioned the Barracuda Jr. for around $200. Probably the best buy for the bucks of any vise mentioned. I have the Barracuda (Sr.) Not that much difference, really. But as an engineer, I was real quick to recognize the virtues of the features built into those vises. And they are made of high quality stainless steel. A real plus if you have to tie outside,,,,like the garage or a shed.

Let me say this for tying rotary. Wrapping lead and floss is such a piece of cake on a rotary vise. Hackle feathers, everyone talks about how easy it is to wrap hackle on a rotary. But try wrapping lead, right off the spool. Or floss from a bobbin. And if that doesn't convince you, watch the Alec Jackson, and the Dick Tallier (Salmon) fly tying videos.

brooklynangler
04-19-2004, 03:33 PM
I spent four years tying on a $12 Indian vise. I then decided to try every vise I could over a few month period before deciding. I had enough for the Renzetti Master vise, but i could not find enough difference in REAL UTILITY between the Master and the Cam Traveller. So, this is the one I got at $145.

I highly recommend this model and recommend Renzetti as they are a great company to deal with.

If you have bucks and time to spare, Lawrence Waldron's LAW vises are probably the very prettiest and nicest in the world.

If they would blow out those C&F Marco Polo Portable tying systems at under $200, I'd definintely bite...but at $600, no go.

my 2 cents---

brooklyn angler

Steelheader69
04-19-2004, 03:44 PM
the dynaking junior trekker as well. I just ordered one for a customer and they loved it. Pretty nice actually. It's the smallest of the Barracuda line. But is extremely functional. I actually sat down and showed him how to adjust and tie with it. Was amazed how light it was too. But same jaws as my full size cuda', and works great. Right at the price limit you're looking at (think $210 retail).

Email me, I can give you alot more info.

flyjkol
04-19-2004, 05:22 PM
I did see a baracuda jr on ebay that went for $185, but with shipping and such it would have came out to more than i could get a new one from a website I found. Final price: $198 no tax no shipping and brand new!!!!!!! I'll spend my extra two bucks on some more floss, I gotta make some coachmans. :hehe:

JDJones
04-19-2004, 06:55 PM
Glad to see you get that vise Jared. I think you'll be happy with it.

flytyer
04-19-2004, 07:47 PM
Congrats Jared!

You got one of the finest vises on the market and you got it for a great price:D :devil: